WEBVTT 1 00:00:08.460 --> 00:00:09.059 Okay. 2 00:00:10.110 --> 00:00:20.070 Good morning, everybody. Welcome to the third meeting of our committee, we are going to start with a quick round of introductions- 3 00:00:20.940 --> 00:00:31.860 Just to introduce who's here, as well as we have a few members joining us via zoom, so I assume the interpretation is working okay? [Spanish Language Spoken] Okay. 4 00:00:32.910 --> 00:00:33.270 perfect 5 00:00:34.470 --> 00:00:39.180 So, I'm Suzanne Turan, I'm one of the facilitators for the committee. 6 00:00:44.460 --> 00:00:47.010 Just a reminder that when you talk, press the microphone button. 7 00:00:49.110 --> 00:00:52.980 Hi, I'm Laura Stock from LOHP, also facilitating the meeting. 8 00:00:54.250 --> 00:01:07.080 Theresa Peterson, and I'm here representing business owners. [Spanish Language Spoken] 9 00:01:10.950 --> 00:01:14.580 Hi, my name’s Megan Whelan and I'm with the California Domestic Workers Coalition. 10 00:01:17.730 --> 00:01:21.810 [Spanish Language Spoken] 11 00:01:25.200 --> 00:01:29.370 Hello, I'm Juliette Hua and I'm representing employers of day laborers. 12 00:01:32.880 --> 00:01:39.930 Hello, I'm Lian Mann, I'm representing Hand In Hand, the domestic employer’s network. 13 00:01:49.980 --> 00:01:55.650 Hi, I'm Nicole Brown-Booker and I am with Hand In Hand, the domestic employer’s network. 14 00:02:04.710 --> 00:02:09.540 [Spanish Language Spoken] 15 00:02:13.620 --> 00:02:24.360 Good morning, my name is Martha Marquez, I am a member of POC Pomona. I am a caregiver and domestic worker and I come from California. 16 00:02:27.510 --> 00:02:32.430 Good morning, my name is Nancy Zuniga, I am here with IDEPSCA. 17 00:02:35.610 --> 00:02:48.840 Good morning everyone, I am Nicanora Montenegro, I am representing domestic workers- specifically caregivers in all areas and I'm also representing the Filipino worker Center. 18 00:02:52.800 --> 00:03:00.000 Good morning, everybody, my name is Kevin Riley, I'm with the UCLA Labor occupational safety and health program or LOSH, Los Angeles. 19 00:03:02.790 --> 00:03:10.080 Thank you, and we have, I think three members maybe or two, on remote, do you want to introduce yourselves, members of the committee? 20 00:03:12.690 --> 00:03:25.200 Sure, I'm Eileen Boris and I'm representing employers of house cleaners and I'm at UC Santa Barbara, from Santa Barbara and thank you for letting me be remote this time. 21 00:03:28.140 --> 00:03:41.310 Good morning, everyone, this is Jessica Lehman and I'm with Senior and Disability Action and I'm an employer of home attendants. 22 00:03:44.610 --> 00:03:50.280 Thank you Jessica, is there, another advisory board member on zoom or is it the two of you? 23 00:03:51.720 --> 00:03:52.470 24 00:03:54.030 --> 00:04:05.520 Okay, can I just ask that people- the sound is a little muffled, so people in this room when you're speaking, if you could get as close as possible to the mic and speak up that would be really helpful thanks. 25 00:04:07.560 --> 00:04:26.160 And we will have the signs as last time that we may flash, if you remember this one is to speak louder please if you see it, and this one is to slow down which we may flash, especially as we are having interpretation simultaneously happening throughout the meeting. 26 00:04:27.210 --> 00:04:37.050 um so as we have done in previous ones we're going to start off by reviewing the goals and agenda for today and also check in on the minutes from the May meeting. 27 00:04:37.560 --> 00:04:49.050 So my if you could please flashed on the slide deck we just have a few slides if people want to watch or as we sort of outline it, but we can go to slide number two. 28 00:04:49.650 --> 00:05:00.780 And that just sets forth our goals for today's meeting, which one is we're going to have a chance to hear you know, in the first meeting we heard the sort of profile of domestic workers. 29 00:05:01.170 --> 00:05:14.520 And their employers and some of the key characteristics and today we're going to have a chance to focus in on day laborers and their employers, and so we have a guest speaker who's going to be joining us for that, we are also going to. 30 00:05:15.780 --> 00:05:23.820 learn a little bit about some other approaches and models for enforcement from other regions, you know how has that looked like and how have. 31 00:05:24.150 --> 00:05:34.620 Other regions considered some of the questions that this committee is considering in terms of the policy recommendations and we have a guest speaker from the national domestic workers alliance joining for that. 32 00:05:35.250 --> 00:05:43.500 And then we're going to have a chance, with the committee to begin, you know, brainstorming ideas for some of the recommendations or approaches. 33 00:05:43.890 --> 00:05:58.140 That you may want to include in the recommendations report that's going to be coming forth, you know as a result of this process and so today we're going to start considering some of those questions so next slide please. 34 00:05:59.610 --> 00:06:01.620 This is really hard to read. 35 00:06:02.640 --> 00:06:05.280 I don't know if anybody can read it, but um. 36 00:06:06.000 --> 00:06:12.990 But I think you have the agenda and it's just going to flow from what I even just mentioned a couple presentations in the morning. 37 00:06:13.230 --> 00:06:26.550 In the afternoon really having that chance for the committee discussion will have a morning break lunch around 12:20 for an hour and an afternoon break leading to public comment by 3:30. 38 00:06:27.930 --> 00:06:28.290 and 39 00:06:30.600 --> 00:06:41.550 We want to just check in about the May meeting and I know that the minutes were sent out, and they also, hopefully, I mean we do have a handout hopefully you've had a chance to look at it. 40 00:06:42.210 --> 00:06:55.530 And first before we move to check in about approving the minutes, I want to see if anybody has any reflections or comments or anything that came up for you, based on the May discussion that you would want to flag at this point. 41 00:06:59.370 --> 00:07:00.060 Thanks Suzanne, 42 00:07:02.430 --> 00:07:07.440 After the May meeting, I was thinking a lot about the presentations we'd heard over the last two. 43 00:07:08.520 --> 00:07:16.530 sessions, both on the hazards that workers are facing and from Carl and Cal/OSHA about some of the standards that might apply. 44 00:07:17.490 --> 00:07:30.570 So I was doing some brainstorming on my own after we met and I often brainstorm well on paper, so I put down some initial ideas that I kind of had taken away from those discussions to think about. 45 00:07:31.020 --> 00:07:42.030 How we as a committee might start structuring some of these guidelines, I do this not to circumvent our process, you know I know we have a process in place but. 46 00:07:42.360 --> 00:07:56.340 I thought it might be helpful for us collectively just to have some ideas on paper to react to, so I've submitted a document for the committee there's copies here in the room, I believe, they were also sent out via PDF last night. 47 00:07:57.600 --> 00:08:05.370 it's this one yeah and it's a two page it's a two page document kind of trying to connect. 48 00:08:06.180 --> 00:08:17.280 What we heard about hazards, with some of the standards and I won't go into it necessarily in detail here, but maybe we'll have an opportunity, as we pivot to the policy discussion later today to circle back to this. 49 00:08:17.670 --> 00:08:23.460 And I do apologize it's only an English right now, but we can get it translated into Spanish for the next meeting. 50 00:08:26.490 --> 00:08:27.870 yeah, thank you Kevin. 51 00:08:29.340 --> 00:08:34.710 And everybody else have any reflections or comments, since the May meeting? 52 00:08:35.910 --> 00:08:38.070 Or, based on the May meeting, yeah, Megan? 53 00:08:39.840 --> 00:08:40.080 Yeah, I just want to 54 00:08:41.100 --> 00:08:48.270 Thank Kevin I will be able to take a look at things after it’s sent out and and. 55 00:08:49.170 --> 00:08:55.740 I'm really excited to dive into these different categories, and it was exciting to actually list the regulations that Carmen 56 00:08:56.490 --> 00:09:03.870 presented and and others that next to some other categories that we were doing that we were looking at for common hazards. 57 00:09:04.410 --> 00:09:14.850 And, and then from from here I'm also really looking forward to really specifying the specific guidelines for employers to follow in each of these areas to really provide that. 58 00:09:15.270 --> 00:09:25.620 The concrete “what to do” about addressing those “how to”’s, so I know that that's coming and in in July, but I'm excited to to kind of. 59 00:09:26.760 --> 00:09:29.670 To get in there and to get into these these categories. 60 00:09:35.430 --> 00:09:48.030 Yeah I just would like to make a littlel comment, I'm not sure if this is timely, but I notice that most of those that had been discussed is more on the responsibility of the employers. 61 00:09:48.630 --> 00:10:02.910 So are we are we on that area, yet on the responsibility of the employers, we are not yet on how about the responsibility of the workers, were are not yet or are we interlocking them? 62 00:10:03.840 --> 00:10:14.430 Yeah, I mean I think when we get to- when we’re diving into that the parameter for the guidelines for how it’s described to educate both workers and employers. 63 00:10:14.790 --> 00:10:26.280 And it's educating on how to identify hazards, evaluate hazards and what they can do to prevent injury and illness, so it is both when it comes down to the particular recommendations. 64 00:10:27.060 --> 00:10:38.730 zAnd I yeah so we're going to be flushing we can talk about both as it moves forward yeah so I just would like to bring out I don't know if it is time to me, but I think we have to bring up also that interface of. 65 00:10:39.150 --> 00:10:47.070 Domestic workers, especially caregivers most of their employers, most of their employers are actually. 66 00:10:48.210 --> 00:10:58.740 household owners and some of the household owners may not even be informed better become employers right but they might not even have the. 67 00:10:59.460 --> 00:11:09.660 The information and the capability to provide all of this safety gadget safety in something like that, so that is I think something that we have to consider. 68 00:11:12.000 --> 00:11:22.740 How this employers and then the workers also they're all most of the workers are afraid of retaliation, so they don't talk to the employees, because. 69 00:11:23.310 --> 00:11:30.420 Some of them are even being paid under the table something like that, so how can we protect those kind of workers. 70 00:11:31.020 --> 00:11:44.790 Are we considering them also yeah yeah and I think we'll we'll look at it this afternoon in terms of the vision that the committee even brainstormed in the first day and that's a starting point it's not like that's the vision and you know. 71 00:11:45.210 --> 00:11:52.170 But some of the things that were put forth as goals, for example, are for employers to be able to do. 72 00:11:52.620 --> 00:12:05.160 You know X, Y Z and for workers to be able to speak up or be able to bring up issues and so then part of what this committee can think of is so what are some strategies to do that. 73 00:12:05.610 --> 00:12:13.200 And who are the players who can do it, you know that's what we're going to be brainstorming yeah I just would like to really emphasize that. 74 00:12:15.600 --> 00:12:30.390 it's not only the employers that we have to look into but the protection, particularly of those workers who first not knowledgeable about this health and safety second. 75 00:12:31.470 --> 00:12:44.790 Some of them are and documented so they're afraid of retaliation, and the third that some of them are not only retaliation, but when say an employer cannot afford. 76 00:12:45.690 --> 00:13:02.370 To pay them even in terms of wages and even in terms of health and safety, these are all compromise so I'm more concerned about how to protect this people who fall in the fall in the gap and fall in depth, you know, in the trunk. 77 00:13:03.900 --> 00:13:12.210 yeah so that is something that has come up as a goal for sure the committee so that we talk about that yeah in general. 78 00:13:13.020 --> 00:13:22.200 um any other kind of top level reflections from a meeting or if not, we can move to approve the minutes, I know that there's a flag. 79 00:13:22.410 --> 00:13:36.000 That we'd have to edit that Julietta was here in May, and she was marked as absence, but that's one change that has already been noted for the May minutes, but other than that is there anything other changes or errors you saw. 80 00:13:39.960 --> 00:13:55.860 So would it be without the committee want to then move that that the minutes have been distributed, and that there are separate giulietta being present correction, they are, in fact, reflecting the meeting, and we can approve the minutes for me. 81 00:13:57.480 --> 00:13:58.740 anyone opposed. 82 00:13:59.910 --> 00:14:06.390 I don't think we spoke we don't think had to do it special motions like that, but I think if the committee moves to approve it, we can approve it. 83 00:14:07.650 --> 00:14:08.070 Right. 84 00:14:09.180 --> 00:14:10.350 And I think oh. 85 00:14:11.970 --> 00:14:24.210 I want to show one more slide in the next slide which is maybe what word I don't know is that legible to anybody sorry now I like epic learn how to do this, we say. 86 00:14:25.860 --> 00:14:29.550 What we see it very well on zoom yeah. 87 00:14:35.550 --> 00:14:37.740 Oh, our projector is. 88 00:14:43.500 --> 00:14:56.610 wow it was a focusing thing Thank you I'm still having a hard time reading it, but, and I see that the the time, the bottom line that shifted I think from when I. 89 00:14:57.210 --> 00:15:10.440 Developed it alright, so this was just meant to show, and I, and then we will bring copies maybe next time, but the monster off and it's supposed to actually line up more nicely on the bottom. 90 00:15:11.430 --> 00:15:20.700 With December, being the final things that are there in pink but I'm gonna, this is a good thing for me to learn in terms of legibility for future but then there. 91 00:15:21.780 --> 00:15:35.370 um so basically it was sort of mapping out the conversations, or what we envisioned as the process between now and December so each of those is meant to be like a month and. 92 00:15:36.600 --> 00:15:43.170 But basically we'll try to fix this and maybe even over lunch get it as a handout that the bigger picture was sort of. 93 00:15:43.590 --> 00:15:49.470 Where are we going, what are we talking about each month, I know, in the first meeting we gave you a sort of outline and. 94 00:15:49.860 --> 00:15:58.800 that the two outcomes, the top one is the blue, which are the guidelines right the sort of guidelines that are going to help educate employers and workers. 95 00:15:59.190 --> 00:16:07.080 And the bottom row is meant to be the green, which is the policy report or the policy recommendations that committee will consider. 96 00:16:07.440 --> 00:16:16.680 And so, in today's meeting, we really are going to focus more on the policy recommendations and sort of that's what the handout that you got with some of the questions. 97 00:16:16.950 --> 00:16:32.610 You know what kind of strategies or changes, you want to recommend in july's meeting we go to the top blue we're going to hone in on like digging into some of the guidelines, and so, for example, for some of the overall goals or even some of the hazards. 98 00:16:33.660 --> 00:16:41.580 You know sort of thinking about what what this Cal/OSHA say what are some already practical suggestions that are out there for the household sector. 99 00:16:41.880 --> 00:16:55.890 What does this committee, want to add and start fleshing out what those guidelines may be then in August we're going to come back and see based on today's discussion what more we want to talk about the power repetitions and dive into that. 100 00:16:57.030 --> 00:17:10.110 And then September continue with the hazards, you know check in on a report out of the recommendations and I will, and then in October will actually be. 101 00:17:10.590 --> 00:17:16.650 In the top row thinking a little bit about where we're at with the guidelines and having to think about promoting them. 102 00:17:17.130 --> 00:17:27.570 kind of written education strategies of the committee wants to recommend and at the same time, with the policy piece will look at a first draft is our hope. 103 00:17:28.050 --> 00:17:35.100 In November we'll look at our kind of talk about the draft of the written guidelines on the top row and blue. 104 00:17:35.640 --> 00:17:43.920 and be like finalizing the policy report, so that by December we're hoping we're going to have you know the final documents for approval. 105 00:17:44.430 --> 00:17:52.830 And we just wanted to show you this sort of map of the process and we wanted to make it somewhat iterative iterative that the word. 106 00:17:53.190 --> 00:17:58.530 So that we're talking about it a day and then coming back August and having a chance to then. 107 00:17:59.040 --> 00:18:14.700 flag questions that the committee may want to consider next month, or if we want to invite somebody to talk about a particular aspect to learn more you know sort of go back and forth a little bit as we're flushing out both both pieces. 108 00:18:15.840 --> 00:18:20.730 Does anybody have a question on this or where we're headed or overall comment. 109 00:18:21.990 --> 00:18:44.520 Yes, Nancy sorry I'm just having a hard time following a little bit um I wasn't sure, is it the time frame between August September when we're looking at graphs of both the guide the guidelines and the policy or that coming in the fall I wasn't able to. 110 00:18:45.900 --> 00:18:48.900 I'm sorry that the munch guts somehow. 111 00:18:49.950 --> 00:19:01.620 shifted in August we are going to be still we're going to practice session based on today are all going on the policy recommendations. 112 00:19:02.160 --> 00:19:12.690 July and September we're going to be talking a lot about the guidelines and the sort of content and what sort of sort of recommendations, the committee wants. 113 00:19:13.170 --> 00:19:19.530 And our hope is that, by September by October will have draft policy report. 114 00:19:20.340 --> 00:19:24.000 yeah so I don't know if that answers your question Nancy of what we're. 115 00:19:24.360 --> 00:19:37.680 And I think oh what I was saying is that part of for us at LOHP is going to be to like sort of take the conversation and discussions and then begin putting that into paper for you to look at and you know start commenting on. Kevin? 116 00:19:43.080 --> 00:19:43.650 117 00:19:45.570 --> 00:19:46.980 118 00:19:54.240 --> 00:19:58.980 we're going to pause for a second to double check the interpretation for those on zoom. 119 00:20:00.240 --> 00:20:05.700 I have a question in Suzanne you began to get at this, but could you say a little more about. 120 00:20:06.270 --> 00:20:22.680 who's going to be responsible for writing the actual documents and then, in particular, I hear you saying hello, he will take the lead, will there be roles or expectations for us as committee members to be working on pieces are in the work where do we fit into that. 121 00:20:27.090 --> 00:20:38.250 So yeah that may be open to discussion, I think it wasn't we didn't want to it's really meant to be on us to draft and write and give you. 122 00:20:39.240 --> 00:20:50.160 Documents to comment on, but if you're not committed if in something someone volunteers to bring something to the next meeting and help draft, something I think that's. 123 00:20:50.610 --> 00:21:02.100 Certainly, possible to as we flush that out, so I think that's something it's both a workload thing like I think we're we're giving you, you know, facilitating it and starting to categorize it. 124 00:21:03.000 --> 00:21:09.750 But it's also a possibility, if somebody wants to volunteer we just can't talk about things, I mean we have to talk about it in meeting. 125 00:21:10.800 --> 00:21:13.110 I think that's that we have anything more to think about. 126 00:21:17.040 --> 00:21:23.910 Maybe a clarification to around like are we able to provide written comments. 127 00:21:25.110 --> 00:21:30.870 Yes, even though and then that just gets submitted and incorporated and that doesn't have to get discussed. 128 00:21:33.600 --> 00:21:38.520 So yes, you will be able to you can provide written comments just to say it yeah and. 129 00:21:39.450 --> 00:21:53.100 And as we're reviewing the drafts I think we'll figure out a little bit like what's going to be the easiest way for us to get a range of comments and then, how do we talk about it in the meeting so we're not so we're sort of elevating issues to discuss and not. 130 00:21:53.460 --> 00:21:58.410 copy edits at the meeting you know maximizing the use of our meeting time I want to. 131 00:21:59.100 --> 00:22:14.070 Just when I was talking about alternating a question came up so June is policy racks July, should be shifted over to the top blue that's going to be mitigation of hazards August is back to the bottom racks. 132 00:22:14.460 --> 00:22:24.750 September it's mostly mitigation of hazard is the focus of the discussion we're hoping will have a report outline for you to look at that that's going to be less time. 133 00:22:25.170 --> 00:22:39.420 And it's really the top and that's what I met when we were like going back and forth, and then by October November we're envisioning spending a little time on both hopefully having advanced it to the point of really. 134 00:22:39.960 --> 00:22:45.990 honing in on issues that we need to talk about, but having drafts to respond to. 135 00:22:48.750 --> 00:22:49.830 yeah they cannot. 136 00:22:51.690 --> 00:23:02.010 yeah so I understand that, through this month that will go into the guidelines and help hone in all of this, but when do we talk about. 137 00:23:03.150 --> 00:23:08.400 The process of implementing the guidelines do we put also in the guidelines. 138 00:23:10.050 --> 00:23:23.640 The implementation process or the enforcement compliance so to have some kind of models, where all of these guidelines that we talk about will be enforced and how would it be enforced. 139 00:23:24.000 --> 00:23:33.630 How will the compliance to be how it looks like something like that, so, in other words you have plans and everything we should finish in that, because this is very important. 140 00:23:33.990 --> 00:23:43.440 But when it comes to the implementation and enforcement do have some kind of models to do that, or how do we go through that will that be included in our discussion. 141 00:23:44.130 --> 00:23:55.680 Definitely, and thank you for pointing that out, I mean that is that's a very important point about how I want to just have guidelines on paper and then, how do we get distributed and so, for example. 142 00:23:57.000 --> 00:24:11.490 In the top bro it says, promoting timeline outreach and education model so that's going to be one aspect like if it is voluntary guidelines, what are some good education and ways to reach employers and workers. 143 00:24:12.090 --> 00:24:16.710 And then, in the policy recommendations like you were mentioning enforcement. 144 00:24:16.980 --> 00:24:30.600 You can think about So what if we want to require these types of things, what would that look like, what are the models, what are the suggestions, what does the committee want to put forth So yes, for sure we're gonna be talking about that. 145 00:24:31.980 --> 00:24:32.790 Thank you so. 146 00:24:38.910 --> 00:24:40.590 Welcome back to this and. 147 00:24:41.850 --> 00:24:57.120 And, but we just wanted to give you an overview of the map forward and how we definitely you know, have the goal of starting to get specific and and starting to bring you some draft language and things to report to so now I'm. 148 00:25:00.780 --> 00:25:09.030 Sorry, this is Jessica Lehman, the question, yes, yes, and also, I should ask is there a good way. 149 00:25:10.290 --> 00:25:15.120 For us on zoom to to ask questions or make comments to let you know. 150 00:25:17.550 --> 00:25:32.010 I mean feel free committee members on zoom to just like what you did Jessica and we're going to also try to make sure to ask you know if there's anybody on zoom who has a question I'm sorry I didn't say that, but thank you just you just. 151 00:25:33.690 --> 00:25:47.250 Have a question was can you um can you repeat, I think I missed the difference between the blue and the Green is it that the Blue is developing voluntary guidelines and the Green is policy recommendations. 152 00:25:49.500 --> 00:26:03.030 Yes, so at the so that the committee has two goals and two outputs that we're going to be getting to and so that was sort of my attempt to map out how we're getting to those two goals. 153 00:26:04.140 --> 00:26:12.060 And so, with the blue it's the voluntary guidelines so it's like and those can be used to educate workers and employers. 154 00:26:12.810 --> 00:26:26.520 and identifying hazards evaluating hazards what they can do to prevent injury, you know sort of tips that they can follow, and then in the green it is policy recommendations to consider some of the questions. 155 00:26:27.210 --> 00:26:34.440 That, for example, they cannot has brought up about how are we going to how, if we want to enforce this what would that look like, or if we need to. 156 00:26:35.340 --> 00:26:48.180 Support employers to do X, Y de what kind of recommendations, as the committee want to move forward great Thank you goodbye process we have have two documents from the committee. 157 00:26:49.950 --> 00:26:53.340 Any other questions from the room or remote. 158 00:26:56.250 --> 00:26:59.220 All right, I'm gonna pass it to Laura Thank you. 159 00:27:00.750 --> 00:27:10.710 Okay, good morning everyone so now we're going to move into the next phase of the agenda where we're going to be hearing from some folks to provide some important context information to the committee. 160 00:27:11.340 --> 00:27:25.860 And the first is, we wanted to provide to the committee, a profile of day laborers and the occupation, like we did domestic workers and house cleaners in an earlier meeting. 161 00:27:26.610 --> 00:27:42.300 So we are really pleased to have Megan Ortiz who is going to give a presentation on this and just to introduce her, Megan Ortiz is the Executive Director of IDEPSCA 162 00:27:48.210 --> 00:27:54.240 OK now we're going to hold off until we resolve the translation issue. 163 00:27:55.410 --> 00:27:57.300 Okay we're okay okay. 164 00:27:58.860 --> 00:28:06.690 Okay, great so just to continue the introduction, IDEPSCA is a domestic worker program and a workers, health and safety Program. 165 00:28:07.230 --> 00:28:17.520 And Megan has almost 30 years of experience in organizing the nonprofit sector so really pleased to have you Megan I think we're ready to turn it over to you. 166 00:28:19.200 --> 00:28:29.970 So, and thank you so much committee members, and everyone at large, a few quick pieces of context, before I begin with the presentation. 167 00:28:30.690 --> 00:28:50.550 One I may also just have asked for a minute pauses in the middle of my presentation, I am on day seven of Covid, which is why I cannot be with you all in person, but also please on if there's issues with my sound because of my voice, please do also flag that for me. 168 00:28:52.200 --> 00:28:54.390 Number two, I think. 169 00:28:55.410 --> 00:29:11.340 I would be remiss in my role as a organizer and executive director, if I did not also place this conversation in context of what happened this morning with the Supreme Court, I think it's very important that we know. 170 00:29:12.360 --> 00:29:24.540 That, as the country is making decisions for people about people and their bodies, we need to think about whose bodies are the most impacted. 171 00:29:25.050 --> 00:29:44.610 whose bodies have always been the most impacted and how that connects to the work we're doing today, when we think about the connections between the protection of whose bodies has been excluded and why um, so I think that's also very critical context for us today and, as we move forward. 172 00:29:45.960 --> 00:29:47.100 And I think finally. 173 00:29:48.570 --> 00:30:03.510 The other piece of context that I want to give is that we're more than a program and I think this will go into the introduction and we're we're the largest day Labor Center organization in the state, perhaps the country. 174 00:30:04.800 --> 00:30:15.270 So what we are talking about is yes, a combination of information from studies that are widely available, but also the deep deep work that everyone. 175 00:30:15.930 --> 00:30:31.080 Does every day, so I do want to acknowledge all of them and their work in not just the information I'm going to present to all of you today, but also the work that we do every day, you can go to the next slide please. 176 00:30:32.130 --> 00:30:32.520 and 177 00:30:34.020 --> 00:30:40.050 So there, as I was talking about there's a little bit about who we are, what we do so. 178 00:30:40.890 --> 00:30:50.880 We do believe in using when we talk about popular education wise a long name popular education is a methodology it's a way of analyzing the world. 179 00:30:51.180 --> 00:30:59.760 Really, believing that immigrant workers themselves can best solve the problems in their industries, and we do this through a number of strategies. 180 00:31:00.210 --> 00:31:16.050 And we have for over 20 years, specifically in the day Labor and domestic worker sector in the areas of outreach education organizing advocacy and workforce Development next slide please. 181 00:31:18.360 --> 00:31:35.670 Oh, so be also translated every slide so we can just go back to that for a second for the Spanish speakers in the room, thank you just for the Spanish speakers, they can quickly see that I know this is also being simultaneously translated Thank you. 182 00:31:37.350 --> 00:31:38.310 Next slide. 183 00:31:40.560 --> 00:31:49.230 Great and just to show, as I did say we operate five day Labor centers in the greater Los Angeles area. 184 00:31:50.370 --> 00:31:55.170 here's an example of some of the work that we do at our daily Labor centers. 185 00:31:57.300 --> 00:32:08.790 Especially during this critical moment of Covid and increased natural and climate accelerated disasters such as wildfires. 186 00:32:11.070 --> 00:32:23.760 Workers come through our daily two percenters on a daily basis, looking for work we help provide that function as mediation between employers and workers but. 187 00:32:24.210 --> 00:32:36.870 Also really looking at the whole worker their, their families and their role in the Community, providing essential services where the state has not done so. 188 00:32:39.450 --> 00:32:40.410 Next slide please. 189 00:32:43.080 --> 00:32:50.280 To just quickly how we're going to do this today we're going to talk about who are the California day laborers right. 190 00:32:51.690 --> 00:32:54.630 And what type of work day laborers do. 191 00:32:56.040 --> 00:33:09.870 who's hiring day laborers some common health, safety and Labor violations that we see and also some current remedies and then i'll just close with some current remedies and areas of change. 192 00:33:11.100 --> 00:33:12.120 Next slide please. 193 00:33:14.190 --> 00:33:17.490 Just let him know and it's fine yard, but I thought it was Christmas time. 194 00:33:23.340 --> 00:33:24.630 Next slide please. 195 00:33:26.940 --> 00:33:38.670 So where Am I getting all this data and information, so a number, a number of places but predominantly one there the last big day labour report. 196 00:33:40.080 --> 00:33:48.930 which I think is really important to flag, there is not a lot of day labour specific information or studies that have been done recently. 197 00:33:50.310 --> 00:33:56.640 So last comprehensive one that we have, although it is from which is significant time ago. 198 00:33:58.950 --> 00:34:16.560 Which is a problem, which is why the majority of the data also will be honed coming from our own experience operating five day Labor centers serving thousands of workers, a year, especially looking at the last two years in sort of the immediate. 199 00:34:17.580 --> 00:34:20.790 moment before coded to now. 200 00:34:22.080 --> 00:34:25.770 Megan, I just wanted to say, we you just cut out for about a minute. 201 00:34:26.790 --> 00:34:31.320 But you're back now so maybe whatever you said in the last like 30 seconds or so. 202 00:34:33.030 --> 00:34:51.060 Thank you, no worries so yeah so I was saying that the the information is also called from our own experience of working with thousands of day laborers on an annual basis, specifically looking at data, right from the before coven hitch. 203 00:34:52.680 --> 00:34:53.400 To. 204 00:34:55.050 --> 00:34:56.400 In the midst of the coven. 205 00:34:59.580 --> 00:35:19.530 So both of these pieces of data are going to speak to one another and then also just on the map, you can just see where our daily ever centers are are located in Cyprus park downtown Los Angeles Hollywood harbor city wilmington area on and Van is. 206 00:35:24.120 --> 00:35:25.980 Next slide please. 207 00:35:28.800 --> 00:35:39.390 slide and Spanish creates it who are day laborers in California, here we have a picture of our Cypress parkdale Labor Center so just. 208 00:35:40.560 --> 00:35:43.830 To look at the some of the older research right. 209 00:35:45.090 --> 00:35:58.410 We know that, and this, but this does remain true that California, is the State that has the most formal and informal daily Labor sites in the country. 210 00:36:00.000 --> 00:36:09.420 and has the most day laborers on in 2004 we're talking about 44,000 day laborers. 211 00:36:10.020 --> 00:36:19.680 Two things about this one what's the difference between a formal and informal day Labor site right a formal site is a site that is operated. 212 00:36:20.640 --> 00:36:41.970 By an organization such as either Scott other organizations, I know that are here also have the Libor sites, for example, the great indie Labor Center I also know that garlic kiva in in the San Francisco area has a day Labor Center So these are operated by organizations. 213 00:36:44.070 --> 00:36:59.910 and funded through a variety of means, in the case of events go, for example, the city of Los Angeles actually provides this funding to operate these centers from its economic and workforce development department fun. 214 00:37:01.260 --> 00:37:18.360 So I think that piece is very important, compared to and also let me go back and apologize also many day Labor sites, including our own, are also you know funded through foundation grants individual donations. 215 00:37:20.400 --> 00:37:35.370 And I can't I think in terms of what an informal daily oversight is we're talking about this is what a lot of people think about when they think of daily birth street corners right areas in and around. 216 00:37:37.440 --> 00:37:57.060 home stores, such as home depot lowes paint stores even we've seen right also just you know other sort of areas where workers congregate where there will be an exchange right of of of Labor for cash. 217 00:37:59.670 --> 00:38:07.980 So I think that is an important differentiation, I think the other piece to add to that is that. 218 00:38:09.150 --> 00:38:20.850 Each site right um can have up to you know 75 workers to 200 workers at a time coming in and out. 219 00:38:22.140 --> 00:38:24.270 Of the Labor face. 220 00:38:25.620 --> 00:38:37.380 To look for work, but also to receive other services, including on referrals to health programs support with wage claims. 221 00:38:38.640 --> 00:38:50.010 One of the things that he that's good does is, for example, support workers through the State lays claim process, as well as local wage claim processes, most of the day Labor. 222 00:38:50.490 --> 00:39:01.320 sites are located near home improvement stores, and the only followed by those areas that are like busy intersections. 223 00:39:02.040 --> 00:39:10.470 I think it's really important to note that, when these formal day Labor centers were created back in the mid. 224 00:39:11.280 --> 00:39:25.230 Early to mid 90s in California, specifically, they were created from a point of view of wanting to hide or contain day laborers, we have to remember that California. 225 00:39:25.920 --> 00:39:38.010 Despite where we are now also had a history of time of the anti migrant and where they were looking to really make more. 226 00:39:38.610 --> 00:39:48.090 of an invisible the day Labor workforce, so a lot of these centers were created originally in municipalities, as a way to sort of. 227 00:39:48.570 --> 00:39:59.250 Get the nuisances of day laborers off of the street, so I think that context is also very important, even if that's not the contacts, from which most. 228 00:39:59.700 --> 00:40:11.520 Failure centers official sites are working right now, but a lot of the criminalization of the sites does does continue next slide please and I'm gonna take a SIP of water. 229 00:40:18.600 --> 00:40:20.550 Thank you next slide. 230 00:40:22.710 --> 00:40:38.760 So here is the 2004 accounts of sort of where the most the Labor sites were and how many workers were at each site, so no surprise, obviously in the major cities um. 231 00:40:39.540 --> 00:40:51.000 I think it's important to note, just like with any information, where we're talking about undocumented individuals in the States this is probably a severe undercount of workers. 232 00:40:52.770 --> 00:41:03.180 For a number of reasons, one we all, we know that day laborers are very, very mobile right, hence the term, they often go where work is. 233 00:41:03.540 --> 00:41:13.920 So, for example, things that we have seen at our day laborers sites is that you will have workers who will be in La for a while and then they know there's you know. 234 00:41:14.340 --> 00:41:23.820 Some projects, perhaps coming up in the Bay area in the central valley and they'll go to work because they are for a few months, and then maybe we'll come back. 235 00:41:24.810 --> 00:41:36.240 So there's also a lot of fluctuation in terms of that there's a lot of internal migration as well when we're talking about day laborers within the state of California. 236 00:41:37.740 --> 00:41:57.780 And also, not a lot of day laborers To be honest, are super excited about participating in surveys and sort of outing themselves, so I think that's a very a reality, we need to think about when we think about just how many workers are being impacted by policies or lack thereof. 237 00:41:59.340 --> 00:42:00.660 Next slide please. 238 00:42:03.570 --> 00:42:05.940 In espanol Spanish. 239 00:42:08.550 --> 00:42:09.150 Next slide. 240 00:42:10.350 --> 00:42:10.590 Sorry. 241 00:42:12.480 --> 00:42:29.100 Alright, so so let's let's talk about that some demographics, a little bit um you know, this is just a snapshot of demographics, in terms of what our average they Labor looks like in Los Angeles across our daily Labor centers. 242 00:42:30.360 --> 00:42:46.740 overwhelmingly they identify as men but women do use daily Labor centers as well, so I think that piece is important and daily or centers are also hiring spaces for domestic workers. 243 00:42:47.040 --> 00:42:56.490 So I think we should be cautious when we try to completely separate the two because that's not the reality on a day to day basis. 244 00:42:58.050 --> 00:43:11.730 And also, I will add that the day labour a demographic information gathering um has not caught up with the time, especially in terms. 245 00:43:12.150 --> 00:43:27.000 Of a workforce development and tracking information of how many day laborers are part of the LGBT Q plus Community there are over the last number of years. 246 00:43:27.930 --> 00:43:46.890 There are, and has been a more transgender day laborers and I think we need to take that into consideration when we talk about health and safety, specifically in the workplace and when those day laborers are performing tasks in private homes. 247 00:43:48.330 --> 00:44:04.170 In terms of ethnicity or race and also what is not reflected on is the large number of day laborers who are coming from indigenous communities across the Americas. 248 00:44:05.310 --> 00:44:16.230 Specifically in Central America and in southern Mexico, which is what we see a lot in Los Angeles, and I also know in the Bay area as well. 249 00:44:17.250 --> 00:44:18.030 So those. 250 00:44:19.350 --> 00:44:23.970 Those indigenous populations, especially people from Guatemala. 251 00:44:25.140 --> 00:44:33.030 And in La haka area and Mexico, are folded into unfortunately the Latino Hispanic care category. 252 00:44:36.150 --> 00:44:50.370 and not in the American Indian or Alaskan native category and I will also say that this is only representative of workers who register at a daily or Center right, we know that this. 253 00:44:50.760 --> 00:45:07.020 These demographic numbers do not represent corner workers, workers who, for many reasons, including fear of being part of you know, an official daily or system choose not to register at a daily or site. 254 00:45:07.890 --> 00:45:26.400 So again, these this is definitely an under couch looking at the age category you'll see that the majority right workers really fall between a wide range of ages from you know 24 to 69 years old. 255 00:45:27.720 --> 00:45:40.080 I think it's important to note that, if you look the majority of day laborers do tend to skew 45 and older than we are talking about generally. 256 00:45:41.310 --> 00:45:43.020 An older demographic. 257 00:45:44.640 --> 00:45:55.230 A when we were talking about day laborers, and this is true, I know in Los Angeles across daily of our centers but also in other areas. 258 00:45:57.960 --> 00:45:59.460 We can go to the next slide. 259 00:46:03.360 --> 00:46:16.410 We have the scheduled for another five minutes to the second work that's not gonna work yeah there's a lot more information, I know we started late, I don't know what can be done about that. 260 00:46:18.090 --> 00:46:25.200 um Okay, we can try to extend a little bit more yeah I know we were trying to keep to the 20 minutes, we have said, we. 261 00:46:25.770 --> 00:46:42.210 were happy going there five minutes would that work and attendance yeah that would keep us in the 20 area that's fine Thank you five five to six minutes, thank you that's wanted to give you a heads up on top Thank you awesome Thank you next slide i'll go a little faster. 262 00:46:43.560 --> 00:46:49.890 I think this is a very important information, information to look in terms of housing status on Monday labor's. 263 00:46:51.540 --> 00:46:57.660 You will see the most of day laborers in general, and this is I'm sure it's true for California do not own their homes. 264 00:46:58.110 --> 00:47:22.230 predominantly a large number our renters are also a large number of helpless they labor's households includes workers who are living on the streets, but also in shelters and just for some clarification on the other category that includes people who are, for example, couch surfing. 265 00:47:23.850 --> 00:47:28.770 Live living, you know, in a you know in someone's living room situations like. 266 00:47:29.880 --> 00:47:30.870 Next slide please. 267 00:47:37.470 --> 00:47:48.480 Alright, so types of jobs, a day laborers you in California I'm according to the violence, when I study back in 2004, and this is really important top three. 268 00:47:48.840 --> 00:47:57.330 Right or construction moving gardening and landscaping I think it was important to note, because when we're talking about gardening and landscaping. 269 00:47:57.660 --> 00:48:11.430 we're talking about predominantly in private homes and we are specifically then talking about where this exclusion applies today Labor so we're not talking about an insignificant amount of daily work. 270 00:48:11.880 --> 00:48:19.860 And the impact of this exclusion in terms of what we're seeing in Los Angeles, a very similar to the. 271 00:48:21.300 --> 00:48:32.850 Numbers cleaning right house cleaning warehouse work gardening and landscaping all aspects of construction moving flyer distribution. 272 00:48:33.690 --> 00:48:43.770 hauling on and we've also seen just so people know such random jobs is also people hiring day laborers to stand in line for tickets for them or to. 273 00:48:44.190 --> 00:48:53.040 buy the next hot round of speaker so I just think it's important to know ideally birds are being hired to do a number of things next slide please. 274 00:48:56.580 --> 00:48:57.690 Next slide please. 275 00:49:00.240 --> 00:49:05.220 So so so so who are daily Labor employers in the states we. 276 00:49:06.240 --> 00:49:12.030 The predominant people who are hiring day laborers are home owners. 277 00:49:13.590 --> 00:49:22.530 followed by business owners and then contractors subcontractors, I think this is really important, because we think that oh. 278 00:49:23.910 --> 00:49:36.810 there's a misconception that the employer employee relationship does not exist between a day Labor and those who hire them for the majority of the cases it's very clear that there is. 279 00:49:37.260 --> 00:49:48.450 An employee employer relationship, especially when workers are being hired by home owners to do specific tasks next slide please. 280 00:49:51.750 --> 00:49:52.710 Next slide. 281 00:49:55.260 --> 00:50:12.390 Just here, so we can see the number of jobs that come out of date Labor centers, but I want to also show the impact of low bid on jobs for day laborers in Los Angeles, and I know this is true of all my colleagues across the States. 282 00:50:14.100 --> 00:50:23.760 A you know, last you know in 2019 to 2020 before coven or when coven hit like in the middle of it we had you know. 283 00:50:24.810 --> 00:50:26.160 10,000 jobs. 284 00:50:27.390 --> 00:50:47.010 or 20,000 total almost 23,000 jobs coming out of us because five day Labor centers and right in the key of coded how that box to almost 13,002 a day laborers saw significant impact on their jobs. 285 00:50:47.700 --> 00:51:00.810 During this code pen jemmott which has, we have not recovered from, so I think it's a very important point to note just also to know what's the difference between permanent temporal casual. 286 00:51:01.830 --> 00:51:12.990 casual jobs are those jobs that are going to be anywhere from an hour to you know, three days temporary would be longer than that and permanent is hey you're hired permanently. 287 00:51:15.240 --> 00:51:16.050 Next slide please. 288 00:51:18.090 --> 00:51:19.500 that's just in Spanish. 289 00:51:20.520 --> 00:51:32.610 I'm running out of time, so I'm going to speak, through these last slides next slide great So what are the most common daily violations faced violations faced by day laborers. 290 00:51:34.140 --> 00:51:44.460 In 2004 but also right now non payment complete non payment so wage theft areas underpayments no overtime pay. 291 00:51:44.760 --> 00:51:54.150 No meal and rest breaks and then there's also the issue of violence, which is very important to note we've had, for example, violence happened, not just at. 292 00:51:55.110 --> 00:52:16.260 homes or work size but also even where workers are looking for work, so those informal daily reporters were workers have been run over by cars, for example, and hit and run incidents on 70% of workers find their work to be dangerous, at least 20% have suffered a work related injury. 293 00:52:17.610 --> 00:52:34.110 That number, obviously, is going to be much higher on, but the reason why this is such an under account is because most workers do not report their injuries either to their employers or to any outside agency next slide please. 294 00:52:38.280 --> 00:52:52.500 This piece is very important because we see that most day laborers are not covered or have comprehensive health coverage on this is an area that still works out very closely. 295 00:52:52.890 --> 00:52:56.100 I know I'm out of time, so I'm just going to quickly. 296 00:52:56.970 --> 00:53:09.480 say this is important for a number of reasons, one, this means when workers are getting into accidents, they are not able to seek medical care or doing so through emergency rooms, and this also means that. 297 00:53:10.170 --> 00:53:19.260 Most doctors when they do see day laborers are not asking them if their injury was obtained while doing work next slide. 298 00:53:22.200 --> 00:53:30.780 I'm just also very quickly and will submit this for the record in 2018 and 19 etfs go specifically. 299 00:53:31.380 --> 00:53:39.810 interviewed almost 200 workers predominantly day laborers and domestic workers of the impacts of climate disasters. 300 00:53:40.530 --> 00:54:02.880 We noted that daily birds were being hired in private homes to fight fires keep fire at bay and clean up ashes, etc, I think this presents an interesting question that we have for Cal/OSHA us whether these types of injuries what fall within the exclusion or not. 301 00:54:04.140 --> 00:54:05.550 Next slide please. 302 00:54:07.140 --> 00:54:17.520 And I think I'm done Thank you so much, I guess we'll open the floor for questions or do any sort of deeper dives I know we have very limited time but thank you so much. 303 00:54:21.120 --> 00:54:39.180 Or the time and the opportunity, thank you Nancy I'm seeing myself twice super weird for Nancy while the loop I gotta see Can you see Sanchez and all of you that's good team to help put this together, but apparently included. 304 00:54:41.190 --> 00:54:45.150 Thank you so much Megan and thank you for taking the time while you're recovering. 305 00:54:45.660 --> 00:55:00.480 A few recover have time after this to really relax and recover so appreciate you being here was a great presentation and yeah I want to open it up now, to see if anyone on the committee has questions they would have for Megan or comments on what what you've heard. 306 00:55:02.070 --> 00:55:10.020 Yes, you can order and Megan Thank you so much for your presentation I'm sorry I haven't even touched. 307 00:55:11.430 --> 00:55:26.640 on the situation and condition of this deeper, but my question is with the Institute very difficult question what programs, have you done in order to reach out to this group of workers. 308 00:55:27.840 --> 00:55:35.400 yeah so we we actually have three main programs through where we do most of our work we do. 309 00:55:36.480 --> 00:55:54.570 Our daily Labor program which operates, the five daily or centers and that's where the majority of workers come in and are able to seek resources employment support wage claims support wage claim mediation, as well as education. 310 00:55:55.140 --> 00:56:04.140 Like esl classes we've done things such as welding classes on and also installation of solar panels classes. 311 00:56:05.160 --> 00:56:24.840 We also have a workers health program Nancy operate Nancy Sunni gas was on the committee and Nancy and that health program working the area of health access so access to health insurance I think there's a lag or we're getting frozen. 312 00:56:28.680 --> 00:56:30.630 Let me hear you fine OK cool. 313 00:56:31.980 --> 00:56:44.850 um the issues of health access, for example, right now working on the expanded medicaid TAO enrollment for the day Labor domestic worker population. 314 00:56:45.270 --> 00:56:57.660 You health program leads are coded outreach and education, helping to provide access to vaccines testing but also worker support when workers get sick. 315 00:56:58.170 --> 00:57:04.140 On and also the health program holds out of the worker health and safety work and the climate. 316 00:57:05.070 --> 00:57:12.240 and natural disaster work and then, finally, but not least, we have our domestic worker program will head is and accion. 317 00:57:13.050 --> 00:57:27.000 which works directly with domestic workers on domestic worker issues, all of these areas, work on the outreach and education we're out there on the street, sharing information weekly meetings where we have you know. 318 00:57:27.480 --> 00:57:37.770 anywhere from 30 to 70 domestic workers on zoom calls on a weekly basis on the bus slides on the street corners. 319 00:57:38.910 --> 00:57:48.000 And at the daily or centers where i'll be happy to share more information, and I know a lot of our other colleagues organizational colleagues do similar work. 320 00:57:49.170 --> 00:57:50.970 Thank you Megan and can. 321 00:57:51.990 --> 00:58:03.900 You Megan first of all thank you so much really interesting presentation and I learned from from what you had to share two things one is I'm particularly pleased that you raise the issue of. 322 00:58:05.430 --> 00:58:18.270 Daily labor's and domestic workers kind of doing similar work or moving between those two categories, I think that's a really important thing for us, as a committee, to keep in mind that we shouldn't necessarily be thinking about these groups, as distinct. 323 00:58:18.990 --> 00:58:28.470 You know, and that the hazards that people face in some cases for us might be unexpected if we're if we're trying to classify people that do Labor and domestic worker, so that I appreciate. 324 00:58:29.070 --> 00:58:42.300 The other question I have is, I know you mentioned 52% of employers are Homeowners and I'm curious if you happen to know or could find out. 325 00:58:43.920 --> 00:58:55.020 How how long those employment relations typically last when it's a homeowner are we talking mostly about people who may have may hire a daily refer a couple hours or a day. 326 00:58:55.380 --> 00:59:03.660 How frequently are we seeing Homeowners hiring day laborers for longer periods of time, not just really curious what your senses of that. 327 00:59:04.530 --> 00:59:24.120 that's a great question and I can definitely pull some more targeted statistics on that from our centers but generally Homeowners are hiring workers in that casual to temporary area so anywhere from a few hours, you know help me dig a hole I'm working on my garden. 328 00:59:26.070 --> 00:59:47.760 hey you know, there are a few cases but they're not super common where we have Homeowners who have relationships employer employee relationships with a day Labor that have lasted years, though, also like this is my This is my regular gardener and he comes once a month. 329 00:59:48.900 --> 01:00:10.740 To my home to do certain jobs that but that's actually tends to be actually far less common most of the jobs tend to be one offs or specific project based jobs but I, but that also does depend, I will be completely honest on the geographic area. 330 01:00:11.940 --> 01:00:20.400 Even within la there's a difference in terms of, for example, you know employers who are coming from you know Highland park. 331 01:00:21.480 --> 01:00:27.120 That area versus employers, you know, in the in the Hollywood hills. 332 01:00:28.800 --> 01:00:32.190 But I can definitely get that information and provide that to the committee. 333 01:00:33.570 --> 01:00:35.100 that's great that's really helpful, thank you. 334 01:00:37.980 --> 01:00:42.960 Other questions from any committee both so Nancy and then he said. 335 01:00:44.070 --> 01:00:46.290 Thanks Megan see you. 336 01:00:47.880 --> 01:01:00.090 Think just the amen around the like how often how long workers daily very specifically do this type of work and how it's connected with health and safety hazards. 337 01:01:00.510 --> 01:01:13.860 You know Megan obviously presented the big picture, but also one of the things that we've seen on the ground right is that workers will get injured on the first day on that one and only time that they get hired. 338 01:01:14.280 --> 01:01:23.940 So I think it's something for us, as a committee, to also consider you know that the length of time shouldn't be a factor in this guidance and the recommendations. 339 01:01:24.300 --> 01:01:35.280 Whether a worker is employed for a few hours it's still important to protect that worker, because that can completely change that person's life really right and livelihood. 340 01:01:36.120 --> 01:01:44.190 As opposed to working for a family for 30 years as their gardener so just something to consider right like the time it shouldn't matter, hopefully. 341 01:01:45.090 --> 01:01:51.840 yeah Thank you that's a really, really important point that we would need to come back to as we develop these recommendation is you want to make an order. 342 01:01:53.220 --> 01:02:00.660 This is just a food for thought, though, and I don't know whether this is part also of the institute to be in the question. 343 01:02:02.160 --> 01:02:11.520 I have seen several they not a lot more day workers in sites that have mentioned, like the home depot and other you know areas. 344 01:02:12.000 --> 01:02:21.750 And a lot of them even stayed there for the whole day, but nowhere is being taken, you know, and I see them just eating alone, they are in, because there's nobody can fire them. 345 01:02:22.170 --> 01:02:29.760 One question also that several employers do not want to just hire because they don't know this people and then also afraid to just get you know. 346 01:02:30.090 --> 01:02:37.650 I got some information Some say that oh don't hire people like that, because you don't know who they are, they might do more, have in your home something like that. 347 01:02:38.340 --> 01:02:54.210 So, to avoid this, this is just my foot of thought, though, is to take this day laborers out of that because they are they're there, they are subject to exploitation, the subject to not only exploitation for violence and. 348 01:02:55.380 --> 01:02:58.170 Health and safety hazards. 349 01:02:59.760 --> 01:03:09.930 How about like I don't know if lanes equal to has done this, but we can have some work centers where people the day laborers can go. 350 01:03:10.260 --> 01:03:22.320 Where we, as you know, some employers will just call the worker Center and say hey we need the air cleaner for two hours or we need some people to do the movie in four or three hours something like that. 351 01:03:22.710 --> 01:03:31.260 And in this case, their force there's an organization, but protects them that they are just not being brought their to the work. 352 01:03:31.620 --> 01:03:40.230 But they're also being managed, in the sense that they're given property, also in the Center can give them some to help not only the health and safety hazard. 353 01:03:40.800 --> 01:03:57.810 But during the rain them, just like what you said, putting them on planning plane train them on other work that they can do, in other words, there are, this is just food for thought works centers that people can run through where they can be trained, or they can be. 354 01:03:58.890 --> 01:04:14.610 dispersed to certain they work to where are the Community instead of hiring from people, you do not know they can just go to the Community and state Instituto I need somebody to do this for for two hours or for two days or. 355 01:04:15.840 --> 01:04:33.030 mean something like this would correspond to me yeah that's actually a huge huge part of our work, so those are the five centers that's exactly what our day labour centers do and what a lot of day labour centers across the State do so that does exist. 356 01:04:34.200 --> 01:04:50.100 And then to the other point I just think you know I think the reality of the sort of day labour landscape is that as long as we do not as a country, and as a state deal with the issue of immigration reform and right to work. 357 01:04:50.910 --> 01:05:04.500 Day laborers are not going anywhere, even with day Labor centers workers are not going to disappear from the street corners, just because of the way of supply and demand on works as well. 358 01:05:05.100 --> 01:05:19.680 In the state of California nation live um, so I think there's also just a larger question that we need to address obviously not here, but in terms of the issue of right to work and immigration reform. 359 01:05:21.150 --> 01:05:24.390 But yes, that that's what we do I know there's two other comments. 360 01:05:25.290 --> 01:05:31.920 yeah and and we're going to try to bring this conversation to a close, but take the last couple of comments family wants to. 361 01:05:32.220 --> 01:05:39.600 share something yeah, I just wanted to on the yeah okay so Megan and then there's some people on zoom that we want to give an opportunity to thank you. 362 01:05:40.440 --> 01:05:58.290 yeah Megan, I just wanted to see if you could share a little bit about how the current exclusion get played out in the Labor because it seems like there's there's what gets classified service, I think it rides this line, I think. 363 01:05:59.370 --> 01:06:05.400 We had problems presentation last time when was citing a case in which dre Labor. 364 01:06:06.690 --> 01:06:14.550 You know, did end up being outside of exclusion or falling outside of exclusion, when it was heavier construction work in the household and so. 365 01:06:15.000 --> 01:06:24.990 Just curious like how that ends up playing out in reality for folks and just pointing at you know, this is the problem with having an exclusion of of a group of workers and that those kinds of. 366 01:06:26.370 --> 01:06:39.630 You know and and that you're reading this line i'd like are you doing domestic service you're not doing domestic therapist when you're in a private home and for day laborers it seems like there's they're often going in and out of that area that Gray area. 367 01:06:41.370 --> 01:07:01.530 yeah, so I think one reality is that, to be honest, most day laborers even when they are working on, you know not in private homes are not availing themselves of the Cal/OSHA system for a number of reasons that i've been highlighted and other spaces, including fear. 368 01:07:02.790 --> 01:07:11.340 sort of lack of knowledge and how to use the system and also just lack of accessibility, to be honest um so. 369 01:07:11.850 --> 01:07:22.020 We don't have a ton of experience to be completely honest in terms of a you know figuring out what falls under the exclusion or not, when it comes to these cases. 370 01:07:22.350 --> 01:07:41.190 What tends to happen to be completely honest when there are worker injury cases on it goes to the we tend to look at it through the workers compensation lens just because that will offer some relief to the worker, at least, especially when they're injured. 371 01:07:42.720 --> 01:07:52.710 And I know I want to leave there's some folks on zoom we want to contribute, I also just want to flag this kind of question that you're asking is extremely relevant for the conversation we're going to be having. 372 01:07:53.220 --> 01:08:01.050 You know, going forward and this afternoon, where we're trying to think about what is it that we need, and where are the gaps and what are the strategy so just to say. 373 01:08:01.440 --> 01:08:06.750 That we're going to have to wrap up this conversation in a few minutes, a lot of these issues will continue to be discussed. 374 01:08:07.140 --> 01:08:13.830 Going forward so just to click that but yes, if there are some folks on the zoom who would like to ask a question. 375 01:08:14.640 --> 01:08:22.350 Yes, thank you, this is Jessica, and I want I really appreciate again for the excellent presentation and learned a lot. 376 01:08:22.710 --> 01:08:36.300 And, and I also want to just be honest about my ignorance of how day laborers work, and I think i've learned a lot over the last few years, men, particularly today but. 377 01:08:37.170 --> 01:08:42.510 I don't know if I'm the only one that you know, obviously we talked about how domestic employers. 378 01:08:43.320 --> 01:08:49.170 are just so invisible Ray that people don't see the work and don't have a sense of what the work is, and so I think. 379 01:08:49.350 --> 01:08:57.990 You know that's where I'm coming from with day laborers and there were a couple things that came up like the permanent versus temporary and I was like what does that look like if it's permanent so and no you don't have time to. 380 01:08:58.530 --> 01:09:12.810 I'm realizing I kind of want a day laborers about like How does it work, and I know we don't have time for that, but if if other people are interested, maybe we could get that at a later point or if there's. 381 01:09:13.890 --> 01:09:19.440 Any materials, you can refer us to I would love that Thank you we'll figure out how to do it. 382 01:09:19.950 --> 01:09:29.850 yeah and we have one more comment, and I was also just going to say that one of the purposes of this is we're going to be flagging the questions that are remaining and trying to figure out how they might fit in. 383 01:09:30.270 --> 01:09:40.920 To future conversation, so thank you for raising that question, and we will definitely kind of see where we can get more into that going forward so much right. 384 01:09:43.710 --> 01:09:54.930 spots sorry about that Megan oh no The response was we'll figure out how we do that daily number one on one either space space I love doing that Nancy knows I do. 385 01:09:55.740 --> 01:10:06.420 Okay, great Thank you so I did you yeah Thank you, thank you very much, and I just want to raise a historical example and I'm just wondering if that's something that. 386 01:10:07.590 --> 01:10:17.670 there's a contemporary parallel that in the early 1930s, the national urban League and St Louis ran a service for domestic workers. 387 01:10:17.970 --> 01:10:29.520 and employers had to sign a pledge to live to treat the workers under certain Labor conditions which included open safety, as well as wages, etc. 388 01:10:29.790 --> 01:10:40.860 So I'm wondering whether there's anything like that when people go to one of your centers and whether that's a component that can be suggested in terms of enforcement. 389 01:10:42.900 --> 01:10:53.130 yeah Thank you eileen for that moving one one of the things that we do do is explained to employers what their responsibilities are, and the fact that. 390 01:10:54.180 --> 01:11:13.350 Almost all except for health and safety in some situations Labor laws apply to the worker that they're hiring plus includes making sure that they are abiding by the minimum wage meal and rest dealing with even dealing with like heat illness and things of that nature. 391 01:11:14.460 --> 01:11:24.660 So it's something that we do go through with employers it's not so much of a pledge per se, as most of these exchanges, to be honest happen very quickly. 392 01:11:25.050 --> 01:11:35.790 um but, but those are conversations and we also use social media a lot, you know this channels, where you know where people are looking for workers. 393 01:11:36.300 --> 01:11:51.540 yelp Google you'd be surprised at the number of ways that people are looking through day laborers through those channels as well, and how we use those spaces to our advantage to educate employers or potential employers, but I think that's a great point eileen. 394 01:11:53.160 --> 01:12:00.990 So thank you so much Megan and, as you can see there's like many more questions so if you we may have more opportunities to hear from you. 395 01:12:01.350 --> 01:12:07.830 Going forward, but really, really appreciate the time and effort, particularly under the circumstances so again rest and be well. 396 01:12:08.430 --> 01:12:13.290 And we're going to take a 10 minute break right now give everybody distress right that they probably need. 397 01:12:13.590 --> 01:12:27.420 And when we come back we're actually having one more presentation, which I think we're going to look at our agenda we're a little bit we started late we're going to adjust we think we're going to be doing more presentation before lunch, but meanwhile we'll reconvene at 10 of 12. 398 01:12:32.340 --> 01:12:40.140 Okay, but I think we're going to get started, just to keep ourselves on time, we have one more presentation before lunch. 399 01:12:41.460 --> 01:12:52.560 And just to double check that our speaker is if the zoom is is ready and we've got our speaker ready to go, so I yeah. 400 01:12:54.330 --> 01:12:57.690 I'm going to introduce you first, but thank you so much for joining us. 401 01:12:58.260 --> 01:13:06.420 So we're transitioning a little bit into something that we think is going to give us a good context for the next conversation we're going to be beginning after lunch. 402 01:13:06.900 --> 01:13:12.870 And as Suzanne said this morning, we want to be moving into discussing policy alternatives. 403 01:13:13.680 --> 01:13:22.800 for domestic workers and and day laborers, and so we wanted to set the context for that conversation to look at some other models around the country. 404 01:13:23.340 --> 01:13:32.460 And we're really excited to have rena aurora here to talk about that, and particularly also to share information about. 405 01:13:32.910 --> 01:13:43.590 what's happening in some states where some of these exemptions have been removed or modified and so rena is a policy attorney with the national domestic workers alliance. 406 01:13:44.100 --> 01:13:51.810 And she is supports the development passage and implementation of policy solutions to improve working standards for domestic workers. 407 01:13:52.410 --> 01:14:04.860 across the country both state and locally and before joining and w da policy team, she was practicing law in New York and directly representing domestic workers. 408 01:14:05.280 --> 01:14:14.070 and other low wage workers in employment, Kate claims and working internationally on advocacy related to domestic workers and migrant worker rights. 409 01:14:14.610 --> 01:14:18.240 And as a consultant for the International Labour Organization. 410 01:14:18.870 --> 01:14:32.670 And in recent years, particularly in light of the pandemic rena has focused on the advancement of occupational health and safety rights for domestic workers, so we really appreciate you taking the time to share your experience with us so I'm going to turn it over to you. 411 01:14:37.860 --> 01:14:42.120 we're not you might not need it, there you go yeah okay great. 412 01:14:43.140 --> 01:14:56.100 um, thank you for that introduction and yeah so I'm going to talk more broadly just about occupational safety and health interventions and the domestic worker industry, I think it's. 413 01:14:56.460 --> 01:15:03.360 really important, when we talk about the domestic worker industry to zoom out a bit to try to understand. 414 01:15:03.630 --> 01:15:13.020 The rationale and purposes of the interventions and the research behind what works and doesn't work, then we can zoom back in and try to apply those to the unique. 415 01:15:13.410 --> 01:15:22.110 Challenges and conditions of domestic work, which I know that you all have been speaking about at length in these meetings you can go to the next slide. 416 01:15:25.290 --> 01:15:35.580 So you know, the first thing is that when we're dealing with occupational health and safety and domestic work, we need to fight against common sense rage because common sense tells us. 417 01:15:35.940 --> 01:15:54.450 Our home is a safe place that cleaning and caring for other parts is just the normal part of daily life and that's there's no risk or hazards involved in doing so, my little photo shows you some of the risks and hazards that our workers do face, you can go to the next slide. 418 01:15:56.370 --> 01:16:07.680 So we know that private home and domestic work exposes workers to a lot of common work related hazards that exist in different industries such as physical and chemical hazards. 419 01:16:08.220 --> 01:16:18.270 ergonomics and psycho social risks, and so they are real consequences to these hazards that our workers are facing and door. 420 01:16:19.890 --> 01:16:21.390 You can go to the next slide. 421 01:16:23.340 --> 01:16:29.610 So when we think about and I I brought me talk about this as interventions and health and safety. 422 01:16:29.940 --> 01:16:39.090 You know what is the purpose of our intervention our desired policy outcome is to reduce work related deaths, injuries and disease on the job. 423 01:16:39.690 --> 01:16:51.780 And the method in which we do, health and safety interventions is by providing both the employers and workers resources, incentives and then also penalties, with the aim of changing behavior. 424 01:16:52.110 --> 01:16:56.610 Because the ultimate goal here is to get behavior that creates that safe environment. 425 01:16:57.030 --> 01:17:08.730 So the you know I broadly put are the strategies that are most common into five buckets one is establishing regulations and or guidelines. 426 01:17:09.390 --> 01:17:20.550 To providing guidance materials three is conducting inspections for is imposing penalties for non compliance and the fifth is running industry campaigns. 427 01:17:20.820 --> 01:17:32.310 And as we go through, one by one you'll see that a lot of these are usually usually utilized uncomplimentary ways, so you can move to this next slide. 428 01:17:36.420 --> 01:17:52.140 So you know, I think that there's been extensive literature internationally and with regards to the US, as well as states that there are significant limitations and our client occupational health and safety legal framework. 429 01:17:52.680 --> 01:17:59.760 And the domestic work shares a lot of similarities with other small businesses who have not been fully. 430 01:18:00.120 --> 01:18:06.510 reached in terms of being able to effectively improve standards for health and safety because. 431 01:18:06.840 --> 01:18:15.660 they've been viewed as low risk right, so you know some of these limitations are that there's limited resources, and we know this, that. 432 01:18:15.930 --> 01:18:26.010 You know Ideally, we would have one inspector for every 10,000 workers but Cal/OSHA only has like one prob you know 102,000 and the same goes for are. 433 01:18:26.460 --> 01:18:31.470 You know more national statistics um you know the currently live. 434 01:18:31.950 --> 01:18:42.660 legal frameworks have limited protection for workers that protect against retaliation that provide for whistleblower protections and that there's no private right of action. 435 01:18:42.960 --> 01:18:51.000 And we know that these are all legal tools that are used when we're trying to better enforce Labor standards of any kind, but they are. 436 01:18:51.510 --> 01:19:05.670 they're not part and parcel in a very strong way with regards to health and safety um another limitation that we face is that there's sort of you know, we have clear standards on. 437 01:19:07.350 --> 01:19:16.080 A highly dangerous what is deemed highly dangerous industries like construction having machinery and highly hand hazardous materials. 438 01:19:16.470 --> 01:19:26.100 But this, but a lot a lot, a lot of workers fall under sort of what's called general industry and there's very minimal guidance as to what that entails. 439 01:19:26.610 --> 01:19:37.860 And that you know, even when we look at large industries, the civil and criminal penalties often are you know extensive research is done been done on this. 440 01:19:38.220 --> 01:19:48.540 are not strong enough and our our week and don't actually serve is a deterrent in the way that penalties of those nature's are designed to do so. 441 01:19:49.080 --> 01:19:59.940 So now understanding these limitations that are built within the systems we have to kind of think about you know what are the solutions for these interventions. 442 01:20:00.330 --> 01:20:14.130 You know that relate to domestic work, but also understood taking the lessons of how these these limitations impact other industries as well, what what really works at the end of the day, um can you go to the next slide. 443 01:20:17.190 --> 01:20:27.930 So they're kind of what we call kind of like three components of like effective employer or health and safety interventions and alarmed researchers show that these. 444 01:20:28.920 --> 01:20:40.500 What really changes the behaviors you know again influencing behaviors through this system of resources, incentives and punishment what really ends up working is. 445 01:20:41.010 --> 01:20:44.790 Employers knowing understanding what is needed to comply. 446 01:20:45.300 --> 01:20:58.110 That employers have a concern for their reputation that would be impacted if they should they not follow the guidance and and this kind of goes hand in hand with how the authority of the law is perceived. 447 01:20:58.770 --> 01:21:17.520 And this relates to the fact that people respond better to interventions when they believe there's a backing of a lot it's not purely voluntary in nature, so I'm going to go through and kind of analyze the existing interventions with these three basic tenants in mind. 448 01:21:19.800 --> 01:21:27.270 most critical features of a positive intervention, you can go to the next slide. 449 01:21:30.540 --> 01:21:43.800 So, in terms of regulations that in order for and some of these some of these things I'm going to be hammering down the point so, but when you have a new regulation or guidance or or guidelines. 450 01:21:44.220 --> 01:21:57.600 The you know the key thing is that employers need to be aware of the regulation for quality so I'm just gonna say, can you hold on one, second, we have an issue I think around your interpretation just want to resolve. 451 01:21:58.680 --> 01:21:59.850 we're switching headsets. 452 01:22:29.160 --> 01:22:31.950 Okay, great Thank you up yeah go ahead. 453 01:22:33.780 --> 01:22:40.140 Okay um so you know, and this is true of any law truly right like which is any new law that's fast. 454 01:22:40.500 --> 01:22:47.310 Employers need to be aware of the regulation that's your starting point in order for its chain influence in each change in behavior. 455 01:22:47.910 --> 01:22:56.580 Then they have to understand, in order to be able to change their behavior they need to understand what they need to do in order to comply. 456 01:22:57.180 --> 01:23:01.830 They also have to believe that the regulation is relevant that it actually. 457 01:23:02.070 --> 01:23:11.580 applies to them, and that the things that needed to to do to comply makes sense to them right like that it's all relevant to their work because it's easy to ignore things. 458 01:23:11.910 --> 01:23:21.450 And I think something like a general industry, you know, maybe something that's going to sound like it's not relevant to a home as the workplace right like so. 459 01:23:21.810 --> 01:23:30.570 You know the relevancy of the regulation, and then there has to be sort of a concern for your reputation and this is true and smoke real. 460 01:23:30.990 --> 01:23:42.660 Personal employers in their individual capacity to small to large businesses right and so people don't want to be seen as law breakers, and what we're doing with individuals. 461 01:23:43.260 --> 01:23:58.230 You know who are employing domestic workers, they are done, you know, we would like to believe that the general we you know, want to view themselves as law abiding persons in this country and that they want to be law abiding and so part of that is that. 462 01:23:59.070 --> 01:24:03.840 You know, they have to have a sense that this is what they need to do in order to be. 463 01:24:05.040 --> 01:24:08.160 A law abiding person and not be a law breaker. 464 01:24:09.960 --> 01:24:11.610 can go to the next slide. 465 01:24:14.340 --> 01:24:27.630 The second intervention is really about guidance materials and those can hand in hand go with education campaigns right, so the regulatory guidelines would be. 466 01:24:28.680 --> 01:24:32.520 No would be the rules, but the guidance material would go to step four. 467 01:24:33.240 --> 01:24:38.400 Further to really kind of explain things in that level of detail so. 468 01:24:38.640 --> 01:24:52.800 You know, research has shown that small and medium sized employers have difficult applying general information to their specific circumstances and prefer like more specific information about what they should do. 469 01:24:53.160 --> 01:25:08.010 And that they're less likely to seek out this guidance material as it's being done so we know big businesses may have you know HR facilities things people that are dedicated to knowing about new laws and learning how they are. 470 01:25:08.730 --> 01:25:24.150 learning how they apply to their workplace and then implementing them, so we know that the small and and smaller businesses require a lot more assistance from government agencies, and that would be hold equally true for the employers of domestic workers. 471 01:25:25.170 --> 01:25:32.730 Most generally campaigns that have been partly been done part and parcel with guidance material. 472 01:25:33.150 --> 01:25:42.780 You know, will improve compliance if there's a perceived likelihood of enforcement right, so the campaign is like here's the information that you need and if. 473 01:25:43.320 --> 01:25:50.760 There is like some knowledge that if you fall out of compliance that you would be subject to some kind of enforcement action. 474 01:25:51.570 --> 01:26:02.310 Social marketing is another thing that is element of a lot of campaigns that deal with public health and which would extend to the concept of occupational health and safety. 475 01:26:02.790 --> 01:26:20.730 Which is you know promotions of life, the social objective of health and well being and we do know there's a lot of high you know what we call like high end domestic worker employers who want to do the right thing, and so a lot of that campaign can also. 476 01:26:22.170 --> 01:26:40.350 be kind of designed in a way that really promotes those goals that we are here, you know, we want to take care of our women workers, our immigrant workers, and these are the tools that that will help ensure that and and and kind of rely on that ethical and moral duty. 477 01:26:41.850 --> 01:26:43.380 You can go to the next slide. 478 01:26:45.810 --> 01:26:52.530 So when we think about this in the domestic worker contacts there has been, you know, a demonstrated. 479 01:26:53.430 --> 01:27:11.430 track record that you know good work, health and safety industry campaigns have a you know, a set of activities that combines inspections with media releases with distribution of guidance materials with workshops and trainings right so that it's a multi pronged approach. 480 01:27:12.600 --> 01:27:21.120 So you know this very much would be what is necessary in the desk domestic worker that you couldn't simply issue gardens. 481 01:27:21.480 --> 01:27:31.320 alone, it would need to be paired with training that was available to employers and workers they gave them the skills actually implement the guidance and ensure that. 482 01:27:31.620 --> 01:27:37.980 This robust outreach and education was allowing the guidance to reach the people. 483 01:27:38.760 --> 01:27:46.800 In their homes and households, whether you know, however, those public media campaigns are most effective at reaching these these arm. 484 01:27:47.160 --> 01:27:57.960 The affected populations and then the you know research also demonstrates that campaigns are most likely to be effective if there is a combination of enforcement and education. 485 01:27:59.760 --> 01:28:01.530 You can go to the next slide. 486 01:28:03.720 --> 01:28:14.040 And so, when we look at the guidance for domestic work, industry and I believe that there was some materials that Andy who produced that has been become available. 487 01:28:14.400 --> 01:28:28.470 To the Members of this advisory committee, we want to understand that there you know, there are three sort of goals, one is to eliminate risk how to reduce risk and then how to provide personal protection. 488 01:28:28.860 --> 01:28:48.030 And those themes apply just as equally to the domestic worker industry, as they would to any author and if we're looking at guidance that reaches those needs that Richard has demonstrated where there's a specificity that allows people to understand what they actually need to do. 489 01:28:49.440 --> 01:29:06.660 checklist checklists and easy tools and materials are critical and getting that information across and here are my my cute little day pegs show some of the things like non slip shoes and step ladders and protective equipment. 490 01:29:08.760 --> 01:29:10.650 You can go to the next slide. 491 01:29:11.760 --> 01:29:25.500 So inspection inspection is you know more generally again taking a little bit of a bird's eye view inspection service, excuse me, I think we go there, we go sorry we just had to advance the slides, but here we are. 492 01:29:27.090 --> 01:29:39.600 I'm inspection from a bird's eye view has dual purposes want in terms of persuading and compelling employers to comply, so this can. 493 01:29:42.000 --> 01:29:42.270 Be. 494 01:29:43.770 --> 01:29:50.550 Patient and can be enforcement so inspections in the health and safety contacts arm. 495 01:29:51.060 --> 01:30:02.940 may provide penalties, but also provides resources that you know enable an employer to truly understand how to comply right because you're in the setting you're able to identify the hazard you're able to demonstrate. 496 01:30:03.300 --> 01:30:09.090 In a with that level of specificity, the application of the principles in the in the situation. 497 01:30:09.630 --> 01:30:15.900 and research has shown that with small businesses or businesses that have never been inspected that what. 498 01:30:16.200 --> 01:30:29.700 eat inspections have been very useful in reducing the incidence of series and injury, because it, it raises that awareness, to the employer about the safety things that they may have not been. 499 01:30:30.870 --> 01:30:32.880 been able to see themselves. 500 01:30:34.200 --> 01:30:53.010 And that the primary mechanism that results and change is like knowing what to do to comply and having that contact with an inspector, who is a government individual is critical, as the as the expert on how to manage hazards and apply the controls. 501 01:30:54.480 --> 01:30:57.540 um if you go to the next slide. 502 01:30:59.340 --> 01:31:02.910 So you know examining sort of what what is. 503 01:31:06.810 --> 01:31:16.290 In home inspection is a part of many other regulatory bodies, whether it's confined to building clothes or tax assessments or things like that. 504 01:31:16.620 --> 01:31:27.930 And while you know, while our jurisprudence does give some values to the home the home is not wholly exempt from Regulation it's just that there are procedural due process elements. 505 01:31:28.230 --> 01:31:40.050 To protect the rights of privacy right whether those are administrative warrants or warrants or other notice or things like that that happens with the home, but that does not negate that the home is a workplace. 506 01:31:40.830 --> 01:31:48.120 And the home is absolutely a workplace for domestic workers and so um. 507 01:31:48.630 --> 01:31:53.640 You know, so we you know, acknowledging and I'm sure you guys have discussed a lot of this. 508 01:31:53.970 --> 01:32:03.360 You know, in it, health and safety scheme they're usually these things, called programmed in on programmed inspections right, and you have a list, and you can do randomize. 509 01:32:03.750 --> 01:32:09.540 And there are challenges in the domestic worker industry because there's not a clear registry of. 510 01:32:09.990 --> 01:32:18.060 of employers who are who isn't who is not an employer, there are certain registries but not a comprehensive one. 511 01:32:18.720 --> 01:32:24.660 But the point being is that there are also alternatives to doing in home inspection. 512 01:32:25.170 --> 01:32:41.790 That provide the same practical tools like photos can be taken to demonstrate the hazards conversations can be had about those, whether it's about chemical hazards those conversations with the materials can all be also take place outside of the home. 513 01:32:43.140 --> 01:32:44.760 And you know. 514 01:32:45.810 --> 01:32:56.310 Inspection as it exists in a lot of field operation manuals are ready for health and safety is often sort of a. 515 01:32:57.540 --> 01:33:07.890 An escalated action by the agencies so employers will have an opportunity to mitigate hazards and then the inspection and penalties only. 516 01:33:08.640 --> 01:33:19.710 come about, once you see willful non compliance and there you put in place on the procedural due process protections and the opportunity to mitigate. 517 01:33:19.980 --> 01:33:27.840 Before people are put into that position, and so that is clearly an opportunity because. 518 01:33:28.380 --> 01:33:38.880 You know, with our field operation manuals on the program on programmed and programmed infections, you know they're not reaching a lot of workplaces, as it is. 519 01:33:39.330 --> 01:33:55.080 And so, so it is you know, perhaps a little misplace to have a you know overarching concern about this when in reality it's not the practices that exist in the interventions that we're talking about. 520 01:33:55.710 --> 01:34:05.850 can all be utilized as well, in terms of getting people making the home, a safe and healthy workplace for domestic workers. 521 01:34:07.020 --> 01:34:08.580 You can go to the next slide. 522 01:34:15.390 --> 01:34:28.950 In other countries I'm a sort of internationally, they are utilizing things, called enforceable undertakings as an alternative to the like enforcement path of immediately like. 523 01:34:29.310 --> 01:34:38.430 loving penalties and fine and this exists in the health and safety and other regulatory fields and those growing research on the effectiveness of it. 524 01:34:39.210 --> 01:34:45.420 So that means that an agency regulator can negotiate an agreement between the government and then employer. 525 01:34:45.720 --> 01:34:54.930 about health and safety issue that has been recognized that then lays out what needs the employer needs to do in terms of making changes. 526 01:34:55.290 --> 01:35:03.030 And then legal action only if they fail to do so well, like the greater legal action be taken upon the Agency. 527 01:35:03.600 --> 01:35:13.110 So why these work, I mean, and these exist already and in certain ways in terms of conciliation agreements and things and Labor standards work. 528 01:35:13.470 --> 01:35:22.020 But what makes them effective is that employers understand very critically, that there will be consequences for continued bad practices. 529 01:35:22.470 --> 01:35:27.330 They are then also given the clear guidance on what they need to do to comply. 530 01:35:27.780 --> 01:35:36.810 And they're hot you know it has the authority of the law and the perceived authority of the law is a binding agreement behind them and, like I said. 531 01:35:37.140 --> 01:35:51.870 People employers of domestic workers have individual households, you know they are seeking largely seeking to be law abiding right and are going to respond in ways that maybe you know some of our larger corporate actors. 532 01:35:52.590 --> 01:36:00.240 could do a different kind of analysis in terms of their risk um you can go to the next slide. 533 01:36:02.250 --> 01:36:02.880 So. 534 01:36:03.990 --> 01:36:08.250 I know I think you were to the previous slide go to the next one. 535 01:36:13.350 --> 01:36:27.510 So I just want to talk about this concept of the authority of the law is really being part of the influential piece of getting compliance, and this is really critical in terms of. 536 01:36:29.370 --> 01:36:42.030 behavior change right that that authority of law is something that motivates be your change, whereas sometimes voluntary measures are not going to lead to such widespread. 537 01:36:43.230 --> 01:36:46.410 Differences didn't go to the next slide. 538 01:36:47.820 --> 01:37:07.380 So I'm gonna you know federal OSHA the exclusion that exists that impacts domestic workers is set forth in this regulation and it's an exception that exists for individuals who, in their own residence privately employed purposes persons, for the purposes of performing. 539 01:37:09.870 --> 01:37:16.770 commonly regarded ordinary domestic household tasks such as house cleaning cooking and caring for children, so that. 540 01:37:17.130 --> 01:37:38.010 Exclusion is is really narrow in its nature right and it's also just part of the regulation and California does have a what we call an OSHA state plan, which means that has its own agency that arm, that is responsible for standards enforcement, but they are bound by. 541 01:37:39.030 --> 01:37:43.320 As the floor what is available and federal OSHA right. 542 01:37:43.620 --> 01:37:59.010 And so, this is a very narrow exclusion, and we have seen other places that have really started to question this the validity of this exclusion, so you know Virginia has struck it this exclusion from its health and safety laws. 543 01:37:59.370 --> 01:38:11.100 And even for for ham we're conducting you know inspections of home care agencies, because they do not fall under the exclusion, they are businesses they're not individuals in their own residences. 544 01:38:12.030 --> 01:38:25.920 And Virginia, you know didn't feel a need to sort of upheaval their system it's just that they struck the exclusion and and domestic workers are fully incorporated as they would be with our workers. 545 01:38:27.420 --> 01:38:35.160 And we see that the a lot of the covert emergency orders included domestic workers and places such as Washington DC and New Jersey. 546 01:38:35.460 --> 01:38:56.730 And both of those jurisdictions are considering just striking the exclusion we've also and I work closely on this, which was the New York heroes Act, which was a law passed in New York to develop a permanent airborne infectious diseases standard and that that was. 547 01:38:57.930 --> 01:39:12.090 A domestic workers were fully included and even were a sub industry that needed a mandate for more specific guidance, which I have been in part and parcel trying to help craft um so. 548 01:39:13.350 --> 01:39:22.260 I'm all that to say is that to get to utilize the interventions that are that are positive. 549 01:39:22.650 --> 01:39:28.140 Which is about getting people to a place where they understand what they need to do to be in compliance. 550 01:39:28.380 --> 01:39:44.280 With the law, you have to have a law that has the authority of the law to to incentivize people to make those changes so striking the exclusion, in our opinion is necessary to truly have a effective intervention. 551 01:39:45.870 --> 01:40:08.940 And we've seen that is been sort of non controversial in these other settings um with that because so much of our OSHA policy as it stands does rely on interventions such as providing guidance and promoting compliance through other measures um you can go to the next slide. 552 01:40:12.240 --> 01:40:13.890 Oh, we keep going backwards. 553 01:40:16.830 --> 01:40:18.180 Sorry, I don't know why it's doing that. 554 01:40:24.930 --> 01:40:34.890 So me think about the more like traditional kind of enforcement of models they usually fall within four buckets you can lift the next slide. 555 01:40:39.570 --> 01:40:57.180 um so one is sort of this complaint driven model which is most one of the most common models of Labor standards enforcement and is a common in the region, our contacts were workers file complaints and investigations only taken upon. 556 01:40:58.680 --> 01:41:01.290 On the basis of a complaint that's been filed. 557 01:41:02.310 --> 01:41:16.260 The other kind of models are agency driven investigations which is largely how occupational health and safety has been a big portion of how the the. 558 01:41:17.130 --> 01:41:31.410 The inspection mandate has worked and just understanding that you know, there are registries that do exist with regards to domestic worker employers, whether its worker's compregistration and insurance and tax registries. 559 01:41:31.980 --> 01:41:38.700 As well as a history of legion our complaints that the Labor Commissioner has of employers of domestic workers. 560 01:41:39.210 --> 01:41:49.410 This um the this model of enforcement relies on agencies to take a proactive approach based on whatever available registries and lists. 561 01:41:49.650 --> 01:42:02.010 To try to investigate and see if people are in compliance and there have been jurisdictions around the country, who have taken a really proactive approach for worker's compcompliance in terms of this and having demonstrated proof. 562 01:42:03.120 --> 01:42:09.900 Another thing that a lot of Labor standards agencies are looking at is strategic communications, so that means. 563 01:42:10.200 --> 01:42:20.550 elevating an enforcement action and into public knowledge through the use of press releases and for it to put people on notice that you know these. 564 01:42:20.940 --> 01:42:32.040 These enforce enforcement is real they're there the agencies are out there they're watching and they will take action when necessary and then using that as a as a. 565 01:42:33.420 --> 01:42:46.140 means to influence behavior and then what is really popular in terms of our industry for domestic worker is moving towards what we call a code enforcement model. 566 01:42:46.410 --> 01:42:54.330 And this is when a Labor Standards Agency enters into formal relationships with Community based organizations such as worker Center. 567 01:42:54.600 --> 01:43:06.000 To aid and enforcement and share information and resources based on their own expertise and part of CBS expertise is having long standing relationships of trust with workers. 568 01:43:06.510 --> 01:43:11.790 That is linguistically and culturally competent to the people that needs to be reached. 569 01:43:12.180 --> 01:43:22.410 um and so code enforcement is critical, but could we do know that our Labor standards agencies are under resourced and that we have a lot of communities. 570 01:43:22.800 --> 01:43:28.710 And some an industry such as domestic workers where people are spread out and these individual homes. 571 01:43:28.980 --> 01:43:36.750 are hard to find and hard to reach, but that CEOs have been doing this for a long time and have those connections and provide a lot of things. 572 01:43:37.110 --> 01:43:50.940 That can bring forth the um you know, bring forth where these kind of Labor standards issues are happening and the people that they are happening to bring to the agencies for enforcement. 573 01:43:51.900 --> 01:44:06.120 So those are the kind of four models that currently exist, I want to go a little deeper into why we think code enforcement is a critical model for occupational health and safety if you can go to the next slide. 574 01:44:09.960 --> 01:44:14.970 So, here are some of the principles that I'm that define. 575 01:44:16.140 --> 01:44:20.100 code enforcement in our industry, you can go to the next slide. 576 01:44:25.590 --> 01:44:30.120 So, as I was mentioning our community groups already have. 577 01:44:31.470 --> 01:44:44.670 relationships of trust with domestic workers, which can take a long time to build out domestic workers are fear or fearful a lot of them are immigrant workers or have been. 578 01:44:45.120 --> 01:44:51.210 You know, put in series positions of exploitation, have made it hard for them to trust. 579 01:44:52.080 --> 01:45:11.670 folks and then there's also a skepticism and concern about government agencies and and whether they're on the side that CEOs have worked very hard to will you know deal with those barriers and provide a safe and trusting environment for domestic workers to speak about their experience. 580 01:45:12.720 --> 01:45:26.310 In California, we already have a you know very large program the d'ivoire that provides ongoing and existing know your rights training with the state funds on wage and hour and paid sick leave, so. 581 01:45:26.940 --> 01:45:36.120 In terms of occupational health and safety should should there be a mandate that they were already well set up to have these community groups. 582 01:45:37.350 --> 01:45:51.480 Add trainings on learning out ID health and safety risks and learn how to mitigate risks to the workers, as well as a lot of these community groups are also employer side and have ties with the employers to share that information as well. 583 01:45:52.380 --> 01:45:59.460 community groups are positioned well because they have and they can provide information and accessible languages that are culturally appropriate. 584 01:46:00.000 --> 01:46:15.570 And they're part of the overarching program of empowerment, which, as I mentioned before, helps to address fears that workers have in terms of asserting their rights and the kind of emotional support that they need to feel ready to bring up these issues. 585 01:46:16.830 --> 01:46:30.870 community groups also provide navigation of the legal system and accompanying workers in situations where they feel they may feel you know intimidated or distrustful and they also can provide supportive communication with employers. 586 01:46:31.200 --> 01:46:40.560 That that as a that allows again to incentivize the changes that need to take place for everybody to be working together for healthy and safe environment. 587 01:46:42.240 --> 01:46:44.430 And you can go to the next slide. 588 01:46:48.030 --> 01:46:56.820 So as we've been saying you know when we look at different all of these interventions and again overarching. 589 01:46:57.420 --> 01:47:12.060 Policy outcome here is to reduce depth injuries and diseases on the job, and when we're dealing with such a diffuse and vulnerable population, a comb forsman model would provide the ability for. 590 01:47:13.050 --> 01:47:23.010 For the government to work hand in hand with CEOs to educate domestic worker about their employers and how to comply, and you know really need that specificity. 591 01:47:23.760 --> 01:47:32.880 would also put domestic workers, employers that on notice that calories are watching and we'll and initiate enforcement actions when necessary. 592 01:47:33.330 --> 01:47:39.990 Again, the authority of the law is really critical in the analysis of behavioral changes. 593 01:47:40.830 --> 01:47:48.900 And then it will allow groups to educate workers about the rights and including the right to be free from retaliations so that they are. 594 01:47:49.470 --> 01:48:00.090 able to raise those concerns and create you know the conditions where workers can complain and do complain when their rights are violated, and some of that may end up not even happening. 595 01:48:01.050 --> 01:48:11.100 In the context of the government, because the workers could just have these conversations and utilize the resources provided by Cal/OSHA. 596 01:48:11.550 --> 01:48:26.700 and direct conversations with employers again the overarching thing here is just to mitigate the hazards and create the safe work environment, so that the worker can continue to work in a way that doesn't jeopardize their own health and safety. 597 01:48:27.840 --> 01:48:39.060 And so that isn't some um you know to sort of the ways that we're thinking through these issues, we can go to the next slide. 598 01:48:41.010 --> 01:48:53.700 You know I'm sure that this research is shared with you, but the you know 20 1927 survey with 700 domestic workers in California 75% of respondents. 599 01:48:54.090 --> 01:49:06.240 spirit one job related injury illness or other harm in the past 12 months so interventions to direct stoats health and safety are absolutely for domestic were absolutely possible. 600 01:49:06.570 --> 01:49:24.570 are absolutely necessary and can be designed to be effective, through this sort of multi pronged approach, taking the lessons of research on on how to build out a you know to incentivize the kind of changes that will create better outcomes for our workers. 601 01:49:26.070 --> 01:49:33.180 And you can go to the last slide So that is my presentation and I am happy to answer some questions. 602 01:49:35.010 --> 01:49:52.890 I just wanted to sort of say that, like this is still we are still working at the cutting edge of moving these advancements forward so um so I may not, you know we're still trying to see how things work and troubleshoot them as they go along. 603 01:49:53.940 --> 01:50:02.940 And that's why it's really important for us to rely on the available research and models in terms of how we are practicing our steps forward. 604 01:50:04.980 --> 01:50:12.990 Thank you so much, that was an amazing presentation and extremely good grounding for the conversation that we're going to be having next so. 605 01:50:13.410 --> 01:50:22.770 Really really appreciate your slides and your information, so now, I want to open it up to the committee members who have any comments and Sokoto did you want to add. 606 01:50:23.940 --> 01:50:24.210 The. 607 01:50:25.260 --> 01:50:27.150 So Korea thing when a presenter. 608 01:50:33.210 --> 01:50:38.880 For 30% 30 kilos employer is completely hold on just one second at least mine is not working. 609 01:50:40.290 --> 01:50:40.950 Get turned off. 610 01:50:42.300 --> 01:50:42.690 Sorry. 611 01:50:55.320 --> 01:50:57.390 Okay that's good Thank you. 612 01:51:05.310 --> 01:51:06.450 But other simply others. 613 01:51:07.800 --> 01:51:10.800 Was cydia percent tactic a useless complete yeah. 614 01:51:19.320 --> 01:51:34.140 yeah I mean, I think that we, I think that there are it's like a little bit of a to frame right we know the authority of law is critical to changing the behavior of employers, but we also know that. 615 01:51:34.890 --> 01:51:48.630 Employers need a level of specificity, with the guidance, so when we think about the sort of division between overarching rules and then what we provide is guidance That gives you the details. 616 01:51:49.290 --> 01:51:54.930 I would just my recommendation is that people guidance, is not something that's like. 617 01:51:55.440 --> 01:52:04.620 bound up in the law, the rules are about it up, but the guidance gives you the know how, and so, while the guidance would be voluntary to in. 618 01:52:04.950 --> 01:52:15.090 terms of, and I would avoid using the word honestly the guidance is there to just sort of really give you the tools that you need and you utilize them to follow the rules. 619 01:52:15.450 --> 01:52:25.710 But having the ultimate legal rule and and the authority of the law behind it, I do believe is critical for making the change because. 620 01:52:26.970 --> 01:52:42.960 You know, we can't estimate the exact amount of employers, but you will have a wider impact based on research, if people believe that they need to follow these rules in order to be law by ID then if they're just promoted as voluntary measures. 621 01:52:44.490 --> 01:52:44.970 Thank you. 622 01:52:46.350 --> 01:52:50.610 Kevin oh Kevin oh wait Oh, what are you did you want to make. 623 01:52:53.880 --> 01:52:54.720 sure you go first. 624 01:52:57.660 --> 01:53:03.420 [Spanish Language Spoken] 625 01:53:04.650 --> 01:53:10.110 [Spanish Language Spoken] 626 01:53:13.590 --> 01:53:13.890 [Spanish Language Spoken] 627 01:53:15.660 --> 01:53:26.580 [Spanish Language Spoken] 628 01:53:27.780 --> 01:53:29.760 [Spanish Language Spoken] 629 01:53:32.400 --> 01:53:33.420 [Spanish Language Spoken] 630 01:53:34.560 --> 01:53:37.410 [Spanish Language Spoken] 631 01:53:42.480 --> 01:53:53.160 [Spanish Language Spoken] 632 01:53:57.960 --> 01:54:10.260 Thank you so much, and absolutely I didn't have a chance to translate the slides into Spanish or other languages that you guys might need by we can definitely make those available. 633 01:54:11.310 --> 01:54:17.070 yeah I think that, in terms of crafting the solutions figuring out again, you know. 634 01:54:17.550 --> 01:54:24.450 photos and conversations or things within the offices mediations when the offices about discussions of mitigating hazards. 635 01:54:24.690 --> 01:54:37.710 There are ways to decrease the cost of having an in home inspection, but a I think it needs to be there in the background, as a consequence, for you know continuing and willful non compliance. 636 01:54:38.040 --> 01:54:52.440 um but I agree, and I think you guys are well situated to come up with those solutions, and I think that is really great feedback for us at gw ways that you know turning this guidance into friendly worker friendly. 637 01:54:53.100 --> 01:54:59.400 would be great for us to think about using videos or other kinds of means of communication, because. 638 01:54:59.820 --> 01:55:13.890 I really take to heart that point that you know, on will also be dealing with a lot of different languages as well and, but that we should make that as accessible to the populations who would benefit from it, so thank you very much for that suggestion. 639 01:55:15.270 --> 01:55:17.550 Thank you, other comments Kevin. 640 01:55:20.040 --> 01:55:24.150 hi rena thanks, very much for a really interesting presentation, I want to. 641 01:55:25.170 --> 01:55:30.000 Two things I think in particular stuck out from what you shared one, is, I think I really. 642 01:55:30.750 --> 01:55:39.600 appreciate the point about the need for specific measures and guidelines, I think that's a really important piece, especially for small businesses, as you said, I'm in this case. 643 01:55:40.080 --> 01:55:46.590 residential Homeowners and I just want to second that I think that code enforcement model that you described. 644 01:55:47.220 --> 01:55:54.690 Is a it's a very good one for us to be keeping in mind, I think we've seen it be used very effectively in other industries as well. 645 01:55:55.230 --> 01:56:05.730 And I think especially here in these kind of contexts where you know you have a smaller maybe more informal kind of work arrangement, I think that code enforcement can be very effective. 646 01:56:06.180 --> 01:56:13.350 at ensuring that any guidelines that we do put out are being followed and, as you say, in cases where there may need to be some enforcement on. 647 01:56:14.430 --> 01:56:17.910 You know outside organizations can play a really critical role there as well. 648 01:56:18.540 --> 01:56:29.760 The one question I have for you is, you mentioned that the State of Virginia had had struck the exclusion so that domestic workers are now included in their OSHA program I'm just curious to know. 649 01:56:30.540 --> 01:56:42.480 Do have you all seen any effects of that any sort of changes I mean House has OSHA in that State actually done enforcement in in private homes and what does that look like. 650 01:56:44.730 --> 01:56:53.640 All right, well, so we were very fortunate at the time that the bill was passed to have a certain administration in. 651 01:56:54.030 --> 01:57:04.350 Virginia, who was very cooperative there were some political changes that happened and the following year that have created some sort of you know, there. 652 01:57:05.010 --> 01:57:13.200 Were the changing of administration there's like delays in terms of people and then obviously their approach to the needs of this. 653 01:57:13.740 --> 01:57:23.310 And so I think we really see this, our first of all it's incumbent on us to make our workers and our. 654 01:57:23.880 --> 01:57:30.300 Employers in Virginia aware and to have those specific guidelines so that before they make a complaint that. 655 01:57:30.930 --> 01:57:39.570 Those are just kind of the precursor step so we're not going to just get like sort of randomized complaints and we are still building or organizing power and mistake. 656 01:57:39.990 --> 01:57:50.490 um but My hope is that you know through partnership with you know academic institutions and with our workers and our and our. 657 01:57:50.940 --> 01:57:58.650 Employers that we will be able to at least create them guidelines that provide inspectors the guidance to. 658 01:57:59.280 --> 01:58:05.130 That that gives them the information necessary to do the job, and right now, without the. 659 01:58:05.640 --> 01:58:10.500 thing specificity like I said the general industry standard and I spoke with the boss about this. 660 01:58:10.800 --> 01:58:23.340 You know, covers domestic workers but it's still it's just very vague in terms of being able to sort of things, so they have handled complaints we slip in trips and hazards in the past, and unfortunately. 661 01:58:24.120 --> 01:58:33.390 For it or not, even for worker's comp in Virginia so there's I guess there's a lot of steps to get us, and so they impact these you know. 662 01:58:33.750 --> 01:58:46.200 Like I said, we are just in the beginnings of this and I think we have to take a very graduated approach to get to the point where we're able to do that, but absolutely if I were to get a case from one of our organizers. 663 01:58:46.560 --> 01:58:50.940 We would bring it forth today, the agency it's just that we're not there yet. 664 01:58:52.020 --> 01:58:54.240 yeah so it really does speak to some. 665 01:58:58.650 --> 01:59:12.420 speaks to the need to have some very specific guidelines for for that sector, so thank you, I wanted to see if anyone on the zoom had a question just to give you an opportunity to unmute and ask your question. 666 01:59:15.360 --> 01:59:16.260 give you a second. 667 01:59:18.840 --> 01:59:20.370 yeah I had a question. 668 01:59:22.080 --> 01:59:32.850 This was great Oh, of course, we know that not all employers and not all workers are the same, that this great variety, even within these very broad. 669 01:59:33.780 --> 01:59:47.520 categories and I'm wondering what you're doing with the whole question that was brought up beautifully by Megan earlier on people who lack documentation and the. 670 01:59:49.080 --> 02:00:10.710 Just the perils there so that's one hand, and, secondly, a UCLA study of a couple of years ago, show that there were great varieties in the class background and the abilities to pay and other circumstances, between nannies. 671 02:00:11.850 --> 02:00:20.340 Employers have nannies employees of house cleaners and employees of home attendance and so How does that fit into. 672 02:00:22.080 --> 02:00:26.430 What you've been doing and seeing in terms of. 673 02:00:27.600 --> 02:00:49.680 These various models of code enforcement etc, so I can think of people on a state support and medicaid need a home attendance, can they afford you know certain things can certain people who are barely getting by and using a nanny for child care for various children's needs. 674 02:00:50.730 --> 02:00:57.510 You know, etc, etc, as opposed to the cleaners, who often a more prosperous, the employees and clean. 675 02:00:58.740 --> 02:01:12.180 Thanks yeah um, so I think that this is really a big part of what the critical need of of the state and state investment is because we do have people you know. 676 02:01:12.570 --> 02:01:24.750 Like I said there's there's sort of risk elimination risk reduction and kiki and if the State were to make available the p P for employers who need it and provide that training outside. 677 02:01:25.110 --> 02:01:35.010 That they could rely on for their workers to be able to attend, then the burden wouldn't fall solely on the employer right and so that I think is a critical. 678 02:01:35.250 --> 02:01:44.280 We do know that, especially within our disability rights community that we need to be working in partnership to to aid them and that, but we. 679 02:01:45.270 --> 02:01:54.810 But we also know that employers need to feel free to raise their concerns and have those resources in those conversations without that fear going to your questions of. 680 02:01:55.770 --> 02:02:04.860 Concerns folks have I mean anti retaliation provisions are the most critical piece, you know we can't. 681 02:02:05.250 --> 02:02:18.690 Even where the law is from wrong, we can't always promise workers that your employer won't retaliate, but I have seen that a rapid response for the government in terms of possible retaliation games. 682 02:02:18.990 --> 02:02:29.790 A simple phone call can do wonders in terms of rectifying situations before they get to the past, because of the promise of pay down the road and penalties. 683 02:02:30.060 --> 02:02:38.220 is not what any you know workers want to feel safe right like, and so I have seen just the sort of. 684 02:02:39.120 --> 02:02:52.410 The need for strong anti retaliation provisions and for rapid response and rapid action on the government, whether it's just a purely investigatory phone call can do wonders to stop the problem before it gets. 685 02:02:52.800 --> 02:03:02.520 To the BAT and then can give us reassurance that we as community groups can share with the workers that these things because, ultimately, you know. 686 02:03:03.000 --> 02:03:16.170 You are entitled to these Labor standards regardless of your status, and so we have to make sure that that um anything that that would jeopardize that things is is. 687 02:03:16.890 --> 02:03:28.740 reacted to and treated as quickly as possible, thank you reena, we have to wrap up this conversation but I'm going to take the privilege of one last clarifying question, if I can. 688 02:03:29.460 --> 02:03:37.740 In terms in Virginia, where the exclusion has been removed, could you just clarify the coverage of that does that apply both you know beyond. 689 02:03:38.280 --> 02:03:48.630 Domestic workers who maybe are employed by agencies, but also to domestic workers that are individually hired by Homeowners could you just clarify once the Lord is removed, who is covered. 690 02:03:49.680 --> 02:03:59.160 Yes, so we, so I think of the exclusion, based on the OSHA regulation that applies to all states with state plans. 691 02:03:59.400 --> 02:04:13.230 So the exclusion as it only applies right now is for individual household so, our position is the agencies are and always have been covered um and should be being covered by Cal/OSHA as well as a state plan. 692 02:04:14.220 --> 02:04:20.850 So therefore in Virginia we struck the exclusion as it existed in the definition of employee. 693 02:04:21.690 --> 02:04:38.490 So that is domestic workers are That was where the exclusion was written into the law in terms of application of the general duty clause and the applicability of federal regulations so individual households are bound by it. 694 02:04:39.510 --> 02:04:48.390 So that is the situation that was within Virginia, there are many other States who do not have. 695 02:04:48.750 --> 02:04:58.380 Exclusion written in, but the question is, is it is that individual household is imported if you've imported federal regulations as your standards. 696 02:04:58.740 --> 02:05:04.650 And then that exclusion may or may not apply as it exists within federal OSHA and so. 697 02:05:04.920 --> 02:05:17.730 But then there are also exclusions in terms of where people are defining employees, so we both struck that to make things and made sure that they were covered by the State standards is available to all of the workers in Virginia. 698 02:05:19.410 --> 02:05:24.360 Green circle household correct yes that's a long winded answer to that. 699 02:05:27.090 --> 02:05:30.870 get some really complicated sometimes Megan i'll give you the last. 700 02:05:31.920 --> 02:05:48.300 question I did just really appreciate that clarification rena I do think it was really helpful to see the national OSHA exclusion written out because it's written differently than the California exclusion, and so I think it's really helpful to me what what OSHA actually covers. 701 02:05:49.680 --> 02:05:53.310 Including agencies, since it's written out as the exclusion of individuals. 702 02:05:55.710 --> 02:06:04.680 Well, thank you so much, this was hugely informative I know everybody's looking forward to getting copies of your slides so it sounds like we can provide that to folks going forward. 703 02:06:05.760 --> 02:06:23.130 So again, thank you for for sharing your expertise and experience with us and what we're going to do now finally is take a break for lunch so apologize for the delay, we got started about 20 minutes or so late and are we going to still have an hour lunch, is that our plan. 704 02:06:24.540 --> 02:06:31.020 Okay, so let's we're going to take a break and reconvene at quarter to two, so thank you again rena. 705 02:06:38.670 --> 02:06:48.930 Good well welcome back from lunch those Tina to keep books happens when and book looks young interpretation see okay. 706 02:06:50.430 --> 02:06:57.420 um and welcome to the committee members on zoom I think I see eileen and it was, though. 707 02:06:58.860 --> 02:07:06.150 Jessica still want to maybe she's coming back, I just want to make sure we know who's on zoom from the committee to keep that in mind. 708 02:07:07.770 --> 02:07:08.280 um. 709 02:07:09.480 --> 02:07:15.990 And my I may refer back to my slide deck if that's okay other I back in. 710 02:07:20.370 --> 02:07:24.000 So this afternoon that we were going to what we wanted to do. 711 02:07:24.870 --> 02:07:32.880 Is as it started to have that conversation really a brainstorm we're not going that we don't need to filter ideas today. 712 02:07:33.270 --> 02:07:40.650 But just really start generating the list of possible recommendations that the committee may want to include. 713 02:07:41.610 --> 02:07:49.890 And then think about them in terms of the vision or the goals of what the Committee said they want to have for workers. 714 02:07:50.550 --> 02:08:02.100 And so, as you recall, there was a brainstorm of a vision in the first meeting and we summarize that in the last meeting and from some of the some of the points that were raised, and you will find it. 715 02:08:02.910 --> 02:08:13.020 In the handout that you received before that you received via email it's also the items will talk about are on this chart but. 716 02:08:14.430 --> 02:08:30.270 Before we get to that detail if you could flash the PowerPoint and get to the slide that was off with the months, where we left off with the bubbles, I did put, and thanks to Dr in case it's useful I did put a corrected. 717 02:08:31.530 --> 02:08:43.980 hand out on your in front of your places and that shows you hopefully the month are not off kilter in the revised and out and so that just shows you what we're going to be. 718 02:08:44.340 --> 02:08:58.680 Talking about each month in the next couple months few months, alternating between the bottom row which are the policy REX and the top row which are the guidelines and then sort of getting by the fall to where we're considering drafts and discussion of both. 719 02:09:01.980 --> 02:09:09.030 that's the Spanish version, and so in the handout that I just gave you it's an English and Spanish and if we go to the next slide. 720 02:09:11.640 --> 02:09:24.300 yeah so as we embark and talking about both for the voluntary guidelines and for the policy recommendations we just wanted to confirm a set of criteria to kind of focus our discussion. 721 02:09:24.810 --> 02:09:37.020 And so, these are not surprising criteria, but one of the things that we as facilitators want to do is make sure we have like the strategic conversations on the things that we want to get to sometimes things may come up. 722 02:09:37.500 --> 02:09:45.090 That are not fitting with these criteria, so we just wanted to confirm that we will prioritize this, and so the criteria is that we're going to be. 723 02:09:45.390 --> 02:09:51.390 Talking about recommendations and guidelines that are focused on prevention of workplace injury and illness. 724 02:09:51.870 --> 02:10:01.710 Related to that they're focused on occupational safety and health hazards and sort of things that fall under the scope of that Cal/OSHA as an agency. 725 02:10:02.280 --> 02:10:14.340 And that they fit within the scope of workers named and sb 321 which we talked about before does this sound okay as that criteria that will help sort of guide our discussion moving forward. 726 02:10:18.780 --> 02:10:21.390 Okay, great and it's really oh. 727 02:10:23.880 --> 02:10:28.980 Yes, Kevin sorry Susanna don't complicate things, I think, just to clarify. 728 02:10:29.940 --> 02:10:41.490 I think we all know this, but just to make it very explicit this when we're talking about scope of Cal/OSHA recognizing that currently scholarship actually doesn't apply to these workers but Cal/OSHA has a realm of standards related to these hazards. 729 02:10:42.630 --> 02:10:48.510 So it's kind of in the context of health and safety hazards within that scope of pelo so you're right so it's not about. 730 02:10:48.930 --> 02:10:59.040 yeah That was a perfect clarification and so, for example, workers compensation has come up in past discussions we recognize that that's an area that probably also needs attention. 731 02:10:59.580 --> 02:11:07.500 But what we can do is park it for now see where we're at in the fall and potentially the the final report could say. 732 02:11:07.860 --> 02:11:17.640 You know, in addition to these areas that we are lashing out here, having to do with occupational safety and health it's important to consider these issues as well in the future. 733 02:11:18.060 --> 02:11:31.980 And then have a thing of workers compensation, I know, last time, sexual harassment came up that's another agency and area, we may not delve into it in this committee, and you know, have an policy pieces or guidelines. 734 02:11:32.400 --> 02:11:36.900 But we can flag it as something that the committee considers important for future discussion. 735 02:11:47.010 --> 02:11:50.370 Thanks alright so With that in mind. 736 02:11:51.930 --> 02:11:56.100 don't know if I want to show well let's go to the next, you have it, as I. 737 02:11:58.440 --> 02:12:10.830 I think I realized that i've been doing too many zoom trainings and when you do a PowerPoint on zoom people can see it but look if we go to the next slide it's gonna be really hard to see I got really into my bubbles. 738 02:12:12.690 --> 02:12:17.880 This week, I was like but you do have it here, and it is also in the handout. 739 02:12:18.180 --> 02:12:25.080 It just shows you the process that we want to propose for talking about policy recommendations and we're going to start walking through this in a second. 740 02:12:25.410 --> 02:12:36.270 But it's like we'll think about what is our goal, what do we want, and then the first step will be to talk about what are the proposed recommendations or strategies. 741 02:12:38.010 --> 02:12:44.460 The next step will be what issues it's on this handout that has this cover. 742 02:12:45.930 --> 02:12:48.900 The PowerPoint deck. 743 02:12:50.730 --> 02:13:02.760 And it's the second to last page it's not super important that you see it it's the same questions that were on the handout that you got ahead of time it's just Okay, so what strategies what policy recommendations. 744 02:13:03.060 --> 02:13:09.930 And we want to emphasize again that this is, we can think broadly about different players different strategies right to reach the goal. 745 02:13:10.440 --> 02:13:21.480 And then, are there any issues that we need to flag or talk about, because if we issue this recommendation, you know what are some things that are going to come up so let's talk about them now and anticipate that. 746 02:13:21.930 --> 02:13:28.560 And then, what solutions might address those issues are what are ways to sort of address possible concerns. 747 02:13:28.890 --> 02:13:36.360 And lastly, if there's any follow up information or discussion at the committee would want, for example for us to think about and bring back. 748 02:13:36.690 --> 02:13:44.100 When we talk about this next and August so that's just the steps of what we're going to take, and so, if it's helpful to you. 749 02:13:44.730 --> 02:13:57.060 We did put a little chart out, but that has those questions that format is useful if you wanted as a tool, or else we have the questions in the handout that you received on Wednesday and it's also in the. 750 02:13:58.410 --> 02:13:59.700 copy there on the table. 751 02:14:00.900 --> 02:14:19.650 So without further ado, what we wanted to do is just take the goals and you'll see them here in the first in either in the handout that you have there in blue sorry, and now I have a lot of paper but or in the chart that's in front of your of your. 752 02:14:20.970 --> 02:14:33.180 In your place the gold or visions are the ones that are in this first column, and then what we're proposing to do is just to start at the top one and kind of make our way through. 753 02:14:33.990 --> 02:14:40.440 With the questions see where we get today and what we want to identify for the August we don't continue in August. 754 02:14:41.580 --> 02:14:45.660 Or can or yeah see where we're at the end of the day, does that sound okay. 755 02:14:47.010 --> 02:15:02.670 Alright, so the first goal or vision that has been mentioned in this community is the idea that employers have a responsibility to create a safe workplace and ensure protective measures are in place. 756 02:15:03.180 --> 02:15:10.950 And so we want to open that up in terms of So what are the types of strategies that you think will. 757 02:15:12.270 --> 02:15:18.150 help you know help reach this goal, what are some of the recommendations that are strategies that you would want to. 758 02:15:19.380 --> 02:15:20.220 bring forth. 759 02:15:28.860 --> 02:15:36.510 And to potential sub questions related to that is like if there are in fact that if there is this responsibility to create a safe workplace. 760 02:15:36.930 --> 02:15:47.370 And is like okay So what does that mean for employers, what do they have to do right what are they complying with something, what does that what is that that they have to do. 761 02:15:48.030 --> 02:15:59.100 And also, what are the consequences of not doing you know so those are the kind of two things that might emerge for the committee to explore yeah Martha. 762 02:16:02.100 --> 02:16:02.640 I'm. 763 02:16:03.780 --> 02:16:04.920 Talking about. 764 02:16:06.330 --> 02:16:09.480 Domestic workers or date Labor. 765 02:16:10.590 --> 02:16:15.480 Workers and sometimes employers ask for. 766 02:16:16.710 --> 02:16:27.780 chemicals to be used that are not say for for us like for the gardener Roundup that's a chemical the car can cause cancer. 767 02:16:29.130 --> 02:16:39.570 find another way you know, to take care of the problem to take it up the weeds or you know, do not ask the worker to do. 768 02:16:40.770 --> 02:16:52.050 To use chemicals that are not safe same thing in that House some people Homeowners ask, I wonder, I wonder, to use ammonia and bleach. 769 02:16:53.730 --> 02:16:58.830 Have the information about what is not safe to use according to that. 770 02:16:59.850 --> 02:17:00.660 information. 771 02:17:01.710 --> 02:17:11.430 don't ask to use those chemicals and at the same time, have an option, where else can be used instead of this. 772 02:17:12.690 --> 02:17:13.110 or. 773 02:17:14.790 --> 02:17:29.310 same same thing they need to work outside they need goggles they need gloves the in the House same thing you know with a pandemic situation provide in what is needed to do the word. 774 02:17:30.570 --> 02:17:30.870 Okay. 775 02:17:35.550 --> 02:17:44.880 So I just wanted that's real, thank you for those comments and also maybe to just offer a bigger context, because if you look at and maybe it's useful. 776 02:17:45.930 --> 02:17:49.920 But to look at the version that has all of the vision. 777 02:17:51.360 --> 02:18:01.200 sort of in sequence, because just to say that what you're referring to is really critical and it's very relevant to like you know if you look at. 778 02:18:01.920 --> 02:18:14.160 You know number six, for example, or or number four, so I think that number one which is the one that, which is the first one is the overarching responsibility. 779 02:18:14.640 --> 02:18:27.330 That that just define that is employers responsibility to provide a safe workplace, then you know how that gets implemented is sort of laid out in in some of the other ones. 780 02:18:27.720 --> 02:18:39.270 So I just wanted to flag, that your comments are really important and they're very relevant to some of the potential the vision and goals that are coming up so. 781 02:18:39.960 --> 02:18:49.920 Just to kind of and we're going to be getting there, but just in terms of thinking of the very first goal it's there's the biggest picture goal that just lays out. 782 02:18:50.670 --> 02:19:02.190 an overarching responsibility for employers to be responsible for providing a safe workplace, so I just wanted to an MRI to clarify that further Suzanne but just to kind of. 783 02:19:03.150 --> 02:19:16.530 You know it's sort of helpful to look at it in the context of maybe even just to take a quick scan at the at the nine goals that are there and that sort of helps to put it into the context about how they interact. 784 02:19:18.600 --> 02:19:27.030 Yes, and I also want to mention that, for the note, I mean we're getting minutes on the comments and so we'll also sort things out afterwards to. 785 02:19:27.990 --> 02:19:31.470 In a way, but I think the, the first thing in terms of. 786 02:19:31.980 --> 02:19:43.830 That bigger picture like Laura was just saying it's like if we like that was something that was mentioned last time wanting a requirement that employers have this responsibility, so if that's a goal of the committee. 787 02:19:44.430 --> 02:19:51.330 Is I'm this morning, we heard some examples of ways to do that I don't know if there's other ideas that the committee had already. 788 02:19:52.230 --> 02:20:00.120 Obviously that we've talked about the idea of the removing the exemption if that's something that committee is putting forth, what does that look like. 789 02:20:00.480 --> 02:20:10.440 You know, those are the kind of things that we were wanting to start within the bigger picture sort of setting the context for that employers are required to do something on goal that was mentioned last time. 790 02:20:12.690 --> 02:20:18.480 I would like to bring up that I think that we need to start with building alliances and when I say that. 791 02:20:21.360 --> 02:20:24.810 I would like to start by saying, I think we need to build alliances. 792 02:20:25.860 --> 02:20:34.770 And when I say that I say that because hand in hand is did a great job, but a lot of places don't know about that so like hand in hand needs to. 793 02:20:35.850 --> 02:20:57.360 form an alliance with is say and ar si si which are residential and commercial cleaners and other association similar to that so that they can spread the word out a lot faster, because a lot of people don't know about hand in hand, you know, so we need to get that information out there. 794 02:21:03.540 --> 02:21:05.160 Other comments Nancy. 795 02:21:07.140 --> 02:21:17.160 I mean just to yes, I totally agree to that, we do need to but just kind of taking a step back with that I think the point about. 796 02:21:17.880 --> 02:21:28.830 The employee employer relationship like that's come up multiple times and it was helpful to hear this morning rate just how that's like defined and how we see it, how we. 797 02:21:29.700 --> 02:21:39.150 see that the home is actually a workplace, so I feel like there's some like finding work that needs to happen. 798 02:21:39.930 --> 02:21:56.040 Whether that's like embedded in the guidance clarifying that in a similar way that we heard this morning with those examples and then I think, building on the existing relationships and creating partnerships with definitely be helpful. 799 02:21:57.750 --> 02:22:07.590 I was gonna say something else oh yeah and I think you know what we were hearing this morning about like a multi prong approach right about piracy. 800 02:22:08.370 --> 02:22:26.550 Removing the exclusion, but also having these other approaches right of like doing education, doing the outreach right which is connected to the partnerships, but I think this piece about that clarifying also, I think, is like really important. 801 02:22:29.040 --> 02:22:44.340 So in the clarifying could you expand a little bit like if you're because it's related, I think, to the other comment you made about removing the exclusion like who needs to who do you suggest needs to clarify which pieces, or what are the questions that we would want clarified. 802 02:22:45.420 --> 02:23:01.200 Sure, and I bet there's other people here that can say better than me, but I think the you know it's it's come up several times around like that's why the exclusion exists in the first place, because it's too hard, or it's not you know. 803 02:23:02.370 --> 02:23:05.730 I think this morning, we heard pretty good about. 804 02:23:07.650 --> 02:23:12.390 How employers are more likely to. 805 02:23:13.710 --> 02:23:26.460 change their behavior if they kind of have that government, you know, so I think like with removing the exclusion, there needs to be some defining right by the government by Cal/OSHA. 806 02:23:27.870 --> 02:23:39.600 I think it needs to be you know, similar to what we were hearing this morning of the examples around the region, our laws right where they do define in the ways that. 807 02:23:41.310 --> 02:23:51.180 A home is a workplace, so I think like it does need to be you know the agencies to state that, and I think that's connected with like. 808 02:23:51.660 --> 02:23:58.260 Removing the exclusion, I think we were also we heard about that with like the way that OSHA defined. 809 02:23:58.740 --> 02:24:12.660 Domestic work and the way that Cal/OSHA defined the, so I think I don't know who exactly needs to do it, I don't know if I'm making sense yeah, but I think like even that and they certify that meaning California. 810 02:24:14.550 --> 02:24:23.220 that's yeah and that's the kind of thing you want to bring some so that was perfect in terms of just started and I'm sorry we can't like be like hey we're capturing it on the notes. 811 02:24:25.050 --> 02:24:25.590 Juliet. 812 02:24:27.240 --> 02:24:36.510 So I was um I think that maybe I'm trying to think about specific guidelines, and I think, maybe number two under visions and goals there's more to me like a specific guideline. 813 02:24:36.810 --> 02:24:50.100 That you could provide for employers that could have some preamble that clarifies that private homes are in fact workplaces and then I like kevin's. 814 02:24:51.000 --> 02:25:06.720 cheat sheet, because I think part of the written contract can include a guideline or list or employers have common things that they need to keep track of like, for instance, monitoring door temperatures monitoring. 815 02:25:07.560 --> 02:25:19.500 The weight of things that are expected to be lifted, so those could be sort of checklist guidelines for an employer to also start to think about themselves and their private home as a workplace. 816 02:25:22.740 --> 02:25:25.650 So that's a good, I mean, I think that what. 817 02:25:27.420 --> 02:25:30.960 Oh, did you have a comment back oh sorry go ahead. 818 02:25:39.300 --> 02:25:48.420 I wanted to go back to number one Okay, because I think I was one of the people that said that very forcefully in the previous. 819 02:25:49.500 --> 02:25:59.610 Meetings meeting, so I think one of the things we're going to have to decide is, as I understand that these are for recommendations not guideline. 820 02:26:00.690 --> 02:26:17.460 These questions we're looking at right Okay, so I think what what we would say we went forward with this is after due consideration of many things, the committee. 821 02:26:19.320 --> 02:26:24.840 Believes that if the employers have to have. 822 02:26:27.930 --> 02:26:29.910 Because, as I understand it. 823 02:26:32.100 --> 02:26:35.370 Is anything before there is no such thing as. 824 02:26:37.590 --> 02:26:55.890 A Labor law, because the current Labor law says employers have responsibilities, except in these exclusion cases, so we would have to be saying very clearly, even though there's a lot of other things that. 825 02:26:57.000 --> 02:27:03.930 We really recommend reconsideration of withdrawing the exclusion. 826 02:27:05.220 --> 02:27:08.760 And one of the things that's very persuasive to me about. 827 02:27:10.290 --> 02:27:15.870 Is the fact that all they have been looking at Kevin saying, excuse me. 828 02:27:17.310 --> 02:27:19.770 It looks like from what you've done here. 829 02:27:21.420 --> 02:27:32.940 Is every single one of these is pulled directly from existing ocean, so if this became our first set of guidelines. 830 02:27:35.760 --> 02:27:40.920 They would be completely within as if we were not excluded. 831 02:27:42.150 --> 02:27:48.120 As if the exclusion didn't exist and, rather than making up other things. 832 02:27:49.260 --> 02:27:51.090 The starting point would be. 833 02:27:53.370 --> 02:28:03.660 OSHA does in fact provide already great existing guidelines, we recommend that we start. 834 02:28:04.920 --> 02:28:09.300 By adopting the OSHA guidelines that exist. 835 02:28:10.740 --> 02:28:14.610 And we recommend that this leads to. 836 02:28:16.320 --> 02:28:21.480 The potential to eliminate the exclusion I don't know if that was clear. 837 02:28:22.860 --> 02:28:23.370 But. 838 02:28:25.170 --> 02:28:28.320 OK, so I just another minute or two. 839 02:28:30.510 --> 02:28:33.990 We know that there are concerns. 840 02:28:35.580 --> 02:28:41.850 And it's in the actual bill that we're supposed to consider privacy. 841 02:28:43.530 --> 02:28:50.520 And so the other couple of things we know we have to consider and speak to. 842 02:28:54.060 --> 02:29:10.440 And then we would have ways that we address this, an example being I say for myself as a homeowner not only if I employ work, I am an employer. 843 02:29:11.700 --> 02:29:13.740 But by the very fact. 844 02:29:14.820 --> 02:29:18.450 That I make an employment, employment agreement. 845 02:29:21.240 --> 02:29:22.170 An employer. 846 02:29:24.570 --> 02:29:25.320 stability. 847 02:29:26.640 --> 02:29:45.600 And we discuss the pain that we all have liability, I agree that can be an add on point, but we all have insurance liability, so one of the things that employers need to understand is. 848 02:29:46.830 --> 02:29:50.700 If we don't embrace and take advantage. 849 02:29:52.230 --> 02:29:56.130 Of OSHA to aid us and help us. 850 02:29:57.900 --> 02:29:58.530 end up. 851 02:29:59.790 --> 02:30:02.610 hung out dry with. 852 02:30:04.260 --> 02:30:23.040 Homeowners insurance workman's liability claims so anyway, I guess I'm just saying, maybe we have to say it, that sharply, but to show that we have given it much consideration. 853 02:30:24.810 --> 02:30:25.230 that's it. 854 02:30:26.910 --> 02:30:34.860 Thank you Lee and so that is one I mean there's you mentioned several things and you did articulate sort of one possible pathway. 855 02:30:35.400 --> 02:30:44.940 Is this idea of removing the exemptions and I think you're proposing that, then all the existing Cal/OSHA standards would apply in the same way in the home versus. 856 02:30:45.390 --> 02:30:58.290 Any other setting so that's one potential pathway in terms like we were asking what would employers have to comply with them anybody have other suggestions or comments or adding to that yes. 857 02:30:59.550 --> 02:31:00.840 Just food for thought. 858 02:31:02.370 --> 02:31:18.630 Yes, it is good to have all of this Cal/OSHA implemented, it will help the home the Homeowners to be more aware of the health and safety, not only for the workers, but for themselves as well at home. 859 02:31:19.320 --> 02:31:30.840 But we have also to consider the situation and condition of possible in four years, and how will the employers be affected by this, what I'm trying to say is. 860 02:31:32.580 --> 02:31:46.710 That I just thought up an example like I talked with one possible employer a home employer she he says actually taking care of her dad and the dad needs a care giver but she said. 861 02:31:47.970 --> 02:31:50.040 We cannot afford the caregiver. 862 02:31:51.150 --> 02:32:02.490 And we don't want anybody to come into the House, because that is an impeachment of our privacy, so, in other words, now a disabled is being denied. 863 02:32:03.540 --> 02:32:13.770 The service of a caregiver so they said that Oh, we need to work also so most of the time I have to remind my dad was something like that. 864 02:32:14.280 --> 02:32:34.470 So what I'm I'm looking at this, is that we have to look at not only the caregiver but also the possible employer and what resources can we give to the employer, so that the services to the disabled is not job iodized. 865 02:32:35.970 --> 02:32:39.330 Yes, and we will that's a good point that I think, and I know we're. 866 02:32:39.780 --> 02:32:49.050 I don't want to like structure it too much with the different goals in the vision, but one of the when we get to like employers, knowing what they're supposed to do, and also that they can provide equipment. 867 02:32:49.320 --> 02:33:04.680 And they have the resources, I think that's something that will be important to think about like so How does that happen, you know what are the strategies to support employers that's right because some of the employers may say oh there's so many rules and regulations now. 868 02:33:05.700 --> 02:33:15.780 I have to work, I can leave my kids ended a nanny to take care of my kids I cannot work, but because of this so many requirements now. 869 02:33:16.110 --> 02:33:28.050 I cannot afford another anymore, so what will I do I better just to stay at home and take care, and that will sacrifice the finances of the family, so instead of helping. 870 02:33:28.950 --> 02:33:44.610 It is putting more the those people in the crock putting the more deeper in the ground mean that's what I am looking Okay, thank you yeah me, and I also know, we have among zoom's broker any can do. 871 02:33:46.290 --> 02:34:01.140 [Spanish Language Spoken] 872 02:34:02.460 --> 02:34:06.360 [Spanish Language Spoken] 873 02:34:08.790 --> 02:34:10.200 [Spanish Language Spoken] 874 02:34:11.430 --> 02:34:13.380 [Spanish Language Spoken] 875 02:34:14.520 --> 02:34:17.610 [Spanish Language Spoken] 876 02:34:18.660 --> 02:34:21.870 [Spanish Language Spoken] 877 02:34:22.980 --> 02:34:36.840 [Spanish Language Spoken] 878 02:34:38.550 --> 02:34:39.780 [Spanish Language Spoken] 879 02:34:41.010 --> 02:34:48.660 [Spanish Language Spoken] 880 02:34:51.450 --> 02:34:54.120 [Spanish Language Spoken] 881 02:34:55.410 --> 02:35:01.530 [Spanish Language Spoken] 882 02:35:03.300 --> 02:35:06.840 [Spanish Language Spoken] 883 02:35:09.210 --> 02:35:11.520 [Spanish Language Spoken] 884 02:35:13.650 --> 02:35:14.580 [Spanish Language Spoken] 885 02:35:16.260 --> 02:35:21.240 Megan and then Eileen, Jessica, yeah go ahead Megan. 886 02:35:22.740 --> 02:35:32.010 Thank you, and they do Erica I'm the same wavelength, I think, too, in terms of the strategies for number one in that. 887 02:35:33.780 --> 02:35:45.420 Any enforcement, so I also want to just you know vocally agree, I think, as a recommendation I think best striking of exclusion as a recommendation that I think we should. 888 02:35:47.760 --> 02:35:55.860 I believe we should put forward as Advisory Committee and so when we get to that decision making point yeah I just want to put myself on the record there. 889 02:35:56.970 --> 02:36:00.120 And then I would say that the. 890 02:36:01.230 --> 02:36:09.150 That like what rena had been bringing up in terms of enforceable undertakings that other countries have. 891 02:36:10.110 --> 02:36:26.160 experimented with or we could learn more about I would love to explore more because there is that part of non compliance happens and then what, what are the steps to bring somebody into compliance and there are other models to that you know could be. 892 02:36:27.780 --> 02:36:30.540 conversations with the consultant unit for example of. 893 02:36:31.950 --> 02:36:43.950 Cal/OSHA to bring that employer into compliance, but we have the written enforceable agreement that have been that compliance doesn't happen there would be further and further steps taken and of enforcement so. 894 02:36:44.370 --> 02:36:54.330 sort of that that help line for both though the worker and the employer to be to come into compliance when, especially when there's been a violation flagged. 895 02:36:57.240 --> 02:37:09.270 So you're mentioning some sort of sort of a tear enforcement process or the hump that we could look at them is that those that model she mentioned, to see what kind of potential examples yeah. 896 02:37:11.250 --> 02:37:12.780 Good Thank you. 897 02:37:14.550 --> 02:37:24.300 Yes, yeah yeah I love with Erica was saying, and I was thinking of what makes sense to employers. 898 02:37:25.170 --> 02:37:32.190 Well, for those of us who have homes, who bought bought homes, we had to go through a home inspection. 899 02:37:32.850 --> 02:37:46.890 Before you buy a house and even when you rent an apartment sometimes you go through an inspection and you see you know what needs to be fixed and whose responsibility is it to fix before you buy something. 900 02:37:47.760 --> 02:38:01.410 So it seems to me that we already have model it's like a pre employment walkthrough does is like you have a pre mortgage walk through in a House, you could have. 901 02:38:02.550 --> 02:38:19.140 A walkthrough that would say Oh, you know before the worker comes you got to fix a B, C and D, because if, while I agree that this should be strike the exclusion that, in theory, all kosher. 902 02:38:20.970 --> 02:38:29.460 rules apply to homes like they apply to all work places in practice, not all Cal/OSHA rules apply to every workplace. 903 02:38:30.180 --> 02:38:43.350 or every type of workplace, so this way, it seems to me what we end up with is a to specify which ones are applied to a specific workplace keeping the general but. 904 02:38:44.040 --> 02:38:50.850 A walkthrough can be an educational opportunity before somebody comes and works for you. 905 02:38:51.240 --> 02:39:07.620 And that's written into your contract and that requires, I think, rather than the shadow economy and this free wheeling economy of a hiring that there would be more centers in which there would be rules for hiring. 906 02:39:10.560 --> 02:39:23.310 Thank you eileen I did just want to remind people and we haven't been doing this before you add a comment, if you could please state your name that's going to help with the zoom minutes and record keeping so i'll have to remember to. 907 02:39:23.880 --> 02:39:28.410 Either call you by name, for, if you could just get your name that's easier, but I'm Jessica, would you like to go. 908 02:39:30.990 --> 02:39:43.680 Thank you, this is Jessica and I a couple things I just I really appreciated the comments about affordability oh my gosh I said, I have to look away because I'm saying to myself very confusing. 909 02:39:44.850 --> 02:39:47.910 So the comments about affordability just recognizing that. 910 02:39:49.110 --> 02:39:55.020 You know that many of us don't have a lot of money and trying to figure out how to do this well can be really challenging and can. 911 02:39:55.440 --> 02:40:03.600 can actually push people to trying to hide things more, which is the opposite of what we want and and related to that I just think as we're. 912 02:40:04.230 --> 02:40:10.590 As we're thinking about what recommendations we want to put out this question of enforcement is so critical. 913 02:40:11.190 --> 02:40:21.570 And and that's the comments other people have made it really resonated with me that in handed here, you know we talked about how how most people want to do the right thing right, and they want to treat people well but. 914 02:40:22.620 --> 02:40:36.810 But that I had hired attendance for years before I ever kind of acknowledge that I was someone soft right and that I needed to think of myself as an employer and take this seriously in a different way and I think. 915 02:40:38.130 --> 02:40:48.570 There are just so many reasons and examples of of many of us wanting to not take it seriously that way right like consciously or subconsciously of. 916 02:40:48.930 --> 02:40:59.160 You know this is just a little thing I don't have time to worry about this I'm just going to have this person to do this thing and I'm paying them and and it's right and I don't need to go any further than that and so. 917 02:41:00.150 --> 02:41:17.700 I wonder if it's a combination of the voluntary and something that this actual enforcement right where even is an agency is almost never going to follow up with someone where you kind of know that the possibility right, and so you know that you need to take these things seriously. 918 02:41:18.780 --> 02:41:22.350 And part of it is like I think the the voluntary is for things to come out with. 919 02:41:22.650 --> 02:41:35.640 A government name on it that that is really clear like if you are hiring someone to do X, Y amp D, you are an employer and you have certain requirements right and to spell them out and. 920 02:41:36.600 --> 02:41:45.180 Just I think the the big picture of getting people to change the way they're thinking about taking this seriously it's going to be so central to this work. 921 02:41:49.140 --> 02:42:04.140 and could I ask you, like you were saying that like you were mentioning that it would be voluntary, but then, how you were describing it is that it's kind of enforceable, could you clarify that for me yeah I'm sorry a recommendation game. 922 02:42:06.030 --> 02:42:19.800 yeah I guess it's like the way I think we're all on the same page that we want, we want to recommend some changes to law right to make things more enforceable but and thank even in the voluntary part. 923 02:42:21.180 --> 02:42:22.890 Is that if we had some. 924 02:42:24.300 --> 02:42:42.810 Like government documents with slightly more forceful language, where it doesn't say like this is the law that you have to do xyz but that says, you are someone's employer right kind of a no matter how you look at it, these are the facts right, and these are the expectations. 925 02:42:44.310 --> 02:42:44.970 That make sense. 926 02:42:46.410 --> 02:42:53.220 Yes, I think so that's something we can explore in terms of like is that different from other things. 927 02:42:53.820 --> 02:43:04.620 I mean that's a question like different than lifting the exemption if they're declaring you're an employer, but I totally understand what you're saying about how voluntary guidelines issued by an Agency have power right there as well. 928 02:43:05.040 --> 02:43:14.700 Is that what yeah and I want to also just so we've been talking about employers having a responsibility and so they're they're what they're and several. 929 02:43:15.330 --> 02:43:23.910 of us have been mentioned in terms of how to create that sense of responsibility, or how to create that legal responsibility and I get and I do want to there's a few issues that we need to. 930 02:43:24.570 --> 02:43:40.860 Probably probe a little bit around that but also coming back to the idea of what they would then have the responsibility to do or comply with one idea was, like everything that everybody else has to do, or comply with and I'm just wondering if just thinking about. 931 02:43:42.240 --> 02:43:53.040 rena rena presentation on relevance and what makes sense if there's any comments that you've or anything like that that you have a views on that Kevin yeah. 932 02:43:53.700 --> 02:44:01.560 like to comment on that, I mean I think when I was putting my own summary together, I was reflecting on that a bit, and I think it's going to be important for us. 933 02:44:03.150 --> 02:44:13.290 to identify ways to adapt existing standards for residential settings to recognize all of the issues we've been. 934 02:44:13.470 --> 02:44:28.740 Talking about issues around affordability issues around logistics issues around sort of whether or not an employer is going to recognize it as relevant so as I was, you know, as I was putting this together and identifying standards that exists, I was also thinking about. 935 02:44:30.240 --> 02:44:39.090 In a way, we needed again these these standards specifically to think about what what pieces of them can we extract and flag and okay. 936 02:44:39.510 --> 02:44:51.810 Yes, this is the industrial setting so we understand that this standard doesn't doesn't apply in in in its full form, but there are sub sections of this are the components of this that are really important to the that can we can pull in. 937 02:44:52.500 --> 02:45:03.180 To residential setting, so I think you know I think that's that's that's work that we could do, as a committee, I think, in a way it, this is sort of bridging in a way, the guidelines in the policy recommendations, because in the guidelines. 938 02:45:03.720 --> 02:45:11.400 We can start with what's on the books for other employers and say here's what we think is important for homes, but then in the policy side say. 939 02:45:12.420 --> 02:45:23.820 You know, as if you're doing X y&z you are legally an employer and then these guidelines are essentially what you're going to have to follow from the OSHA point of view, I think that that is a good pairing. 940 02:45:25.380 --> 02:45:28.290 Thank you Megan, Martha? 941 02:45:31.860 --> 02:45:36.990 [Spanish Language Spoken] 942 02:45:42.030 --> 02:46:09.180 [Spanish Language Spoken] 943 02:46:10.200 --> 02:46:14.220 [Spanish Language Spoken] 944 02:46:15.510 --> 02:46:27.390 [Spanish Language Spoken] 945 02:46:28.560 --> 02:46:50.790 [Spanish Language Spoken] 946 02:46:52.140 --> 02:47:06.570 [Spanish Language Spoken] 947 02:47:07.440 --> 02:47:24.210 [Spanish Language Spoken] 948 02:47:25.830 --> 02:47:48.630 [Spanish Language Spoken] 949 02:47:49.680 --> 02:48:02.550 [Spanish Language Spoken] 950 02:48:03.690 --> 02:48:17.190 [Spanish Language Spoken] 951 02:48:18.390 --> 02:48:24.210 [Spanish Language Spoken] 952 02:48:25.710 --> 02:48:30.960 [Spanish Language Spoken] 953 02:48:32.010 --> 02:48:38.550 [Spanish Language Spoken] 954 02:48:39.600 --> 02:48:48.990 [Spanish Language Spoken] 955 02:48:51.960 --> 02:48:55.380 [Spanish Language Spoken] 956 02:48:57.420 --> 02:49:02.130 [Spanish Language Spoken] 957 02:49:09.210 --> 02:49:10.830 [Spanish Language Spoken] 958 02:49:11.970 --> 02:49:22.020 [Spanish Language Spoken] 959 02:49:23.280 --> 02:49:31.290 [Spanish Language Spoken] 960 02:49:32.940 --> 02:49:57.600 [Spanish Language Spoken] 961 02:49:58.950 --> 02:50:08.040 [Spanish Language Spoken] 962 02:50:09.090 --> 02:50:10.200 [Spanish Language Spoken] 963 02:50:11.760 --> 02:50:17.580 Nancy? 964 02:50:18.660 --> 02:50:32.010 yeah I wanted to add I don't know where this fits within the first one, but I'm a common I had made earlier, my name is Nancy, about the length of employment, I think. 965 02:50:33.510 --> 02:50:36.360 clarifying right the employer relationship. 966 02:50:37.440 --> 02:50:51.630 But also like that it doesn't matter right how long is there's that worker agreement if there's that employer employee relationship that health and safety, you know those that aspect also needs to be considered. 967 02:50:52.980 --> 02:51:02.640 And then I think the other piece was like the specificity and the general of the existing Cal/OSHA. 968 02:51:03.990 --> 02:51:16.290 Standards one of the things that I think I mentioned that last time IDEPSCA we're working with the La county department of public health in creating local guidelines for domestic work around coven. 969 02:51:17.550 --> 02:51:29.580 One of the things that we're doing there is we're trying to use the existing covert recommendations right for the general public and trying to see how that applies in a private home. 970 02:51:30.360 --> 02:51:37.920 So I think in a similar way right like there's the general like the mask us, for example, right like wash your hands. 971 02:51:38.460 --> 02:51:57.420 But then there's also very specific things that I'm looking at right like for living, what does that look like for a caregiver what does that look like if they're taking care of the person that potentially has pulled it right, so I think that there's just in terms of how we go. 972 02:51:58.530 --> 02:52:04.680 Looking at the guidance, but also, you know, even with the removing the exclusion and what's relevant. 973 02:52:05.310 --> 02:52:21.810 I think we do need to look at the general but also like really dig a little deeper and to what are the conditions that domestic workers and the leavers have right like live in, or sometimes doing temporary work just kind of. 974 02:52:23.040 --> 02:52:29.670 Putting that in the background, when we're kind of trying to draw out some of the things that like Kevin already started drafting. 975 02:52:31.260 --> 02:52:42.060 And just to follow up on that real quick I do want to flag, a couple things you said, except that is partly what question, we were going to post to the committee like if there's a recommendation around the exemption around following certain. 976 02:52:42.690 --> 02:52:52.590 All the standards are modified standards for the industry, do you envision it applying to all workers, regardless of how hired or. 977 02:52:53.100 --> 02:53:05.040 at length of time working, you know, sometimes there's a trigger of ours is that something that committee would want to consider or not, or is it going to be universal so that's a question, we would have for you in terms of scope Megan. 978 02:53:07.050 --> 02:53:10.470 I think, just in in response to that replay I think that. 979 02:53:11.520 --> 02:53:15.750 Could you talk a little louder just in response to that question around scope. 980 02:53:16.830 --> 02:53:34.080 Really quickly, I think, given the presentation, then even Megan's presentation today about the nature of daily birds and then what we've heard from the presentations before on the demographics and and practices of domestic workers, I think that. 981 02:53:36.000 --> 02:53:47.430 I think we should consider that all workers would be included and because of the nature of this industry and and just kind of. 982 02:53:48.330 --> 02:53:59.070 Adding on to what Nancy was saying, because I think that specificity piece is we're hearing it at a few different ways, and I just want to highlight how it connects to arenas presentation as well. 983 02:53:59.640 --> 02:54:09.240 And that you know, like how to change behavior is showing showing employers, how you know, like being specific on the guidelines of how to so. 984 02:54:09.870 --> 02:54:21.060 Say there's a regulation on on that lifting but then showing the guidelines of how then does that apply to the workplace, I think, is is the work that we're doing in the guidelines and. 985 02:54:21.510 --> 02:54:27.540 But the regulation exists right, but then the guidelines, help to specify and show employers, how and. 986 02:54:28.290 --> 02:54:37.470 Then there's the the specificity of how, and then the relevance, both of those help to and then there's the authority of the law so like all that those elements that rena. 987 02:54:38.100 --> 02:54:46.860 demonstrate I feel like is is that multi pronged approach to change behavior towards employers getting towards compliance and then that piece. 988 02:54:48.000 --> 02:54:50.310 Just reiterating that employers, then. 989 02:54:51.360 --> 02:54:58.980 would have support would have support to get to compliance because maybe at first they don't see themselves as employers, but needs to see themselves as employers. 990 02:54:59.310 --> 02:55:09.780 So need that that level of you are an employer right like that level of support and then these are the ways in which, in which you can apply these are the, these are the resources, these are the trainings that can get you there. 991 02:55:10.920 --> 02:55:11.820 Okay, thank you. 992 02:55:13.440 --> 02:55:19.800 Any other ideas to to mention in terms of this idea of the employers responsibility? 993 02:55:23.310 --> 02:55:29.160 sure that or concerns that people may have or questions around it so quarter and then leanne. 994 02:55:32.400 --> 02:55:35.280 [Spanish Language Spoken] 995 02:55:37.140 --> 02:55:42.420 [Spanish Language Spoken] 996 02:55:43.710 --> 02:55:48.900 [Spanish Language Spoken] 997 02:55:50.850 --> 02:55:56.820 [Spanish Language Spoken] 998 02:55:58.170 --> 02:56:05.580 [Spanish Language Spoken] 999 02:56:06.900 --> 02:56:13.410 [Spanish Language Spoken] 1000 02:56:14.490 --> 02:56:26.460 [Spanish Language Spoken] 1001 02:56:28.560 --> 02:56:33.990 [Spanish Language Spoken] 1002 02:56:35.130 --> 02:56:44.670 [Spanish Language Spoken] 1003 02:56:45.960 --> 02:56:46.350 [Spanish Language Spoken] 1004 02:56:47.580 --> 02:56:57.450 [Spanish Language Spoken] 1005 02:57:00.240 --> 02:57:03.960 [Spanish Language Spoken] 1006 02:57:06.150 --> 02:57:10.830 [Spanish Language Spoken] 1007 02:57:12.510 --> 02:57:13.950 [Spanish Language Spoken] 1008 02:57:15.780 --> 02:57:16.740 [Spanish Language Spoken] 1009 02:57:19.980 --> 02:57:21.750 [Spanish Language Spoken] 1010 02:57:24.840 --> 02:57:26.490 It sounds a little bit like what. 1011 02:57:28.860 --> 02:57:40.050 Lian was saying to and numbers of us have had the idea that you have to have a certificate and for hedging registration to employ in your home. 1012 02:57:41.520 --> 02:57:44.280 But what I wanted to say was. 1013 02:57:47.850 --> 02:58:08.550 We all have in the back of our mind I think of version of what responsibility means that is not the law but it's more of a human rights, responsibility and I'm not sure how that would fit into a document like this, but I think, even if we don't. 1014 02:58:10.020 --> 02:58:17.580 Make the the most sharp recommendation which I still have we will, as one of the recommendations. 1015 02:58:19.590 --> 02:58:32.640 I think we want to develop some language around our human responsibilities to each other and moving towards the. 1016 02:58:35.490 --> 02:58:40.260 The collaborative society that we hope to have something like that. 1017 02:58:41.280 --> 02:58:45.210 And along that line, I think we don't have to. 1018 02:58:47.580 --> 02:58:58.650 Technically, get rid of the exclusion in order to embrace and adopt elements of what OSHA has to offer. 1019 02:59:01.410 --> 02:59:08.040 I don't know what it would mean like whether we would be an entitled to those things, but I think for employers. 1020 02:59:10.620 --> 02:59:17.850 One of the things I would like to do is put out the view of how much there is to gain. 1021 02:59:19.170 --> 02:59:26.100 By our having recommendations and guidelines and even if we're not. 1022 02:59:29.880 --> 02:59:36.900 I don't know legally subordinate to OSHA can we take advantage of and participate in. 1023 02:59:37.920 --> 02:59:38.910 osha's. 1024 02:59:41.220 --> 02:59:44.370 trainings and preparations for. 1025 02:59:46.410 --> 02:59:47.220 What is it called. 1026 02:59:48.540 --> 02:59:52.080 illness and injury prevention programs in the home. 1027 02:59:53.370 --> 02:59:58.800 And I think I understand because they are offered all the time, all over the place. 1028 02:59:59.880 --> 03:00:06.390 That we you know employers could start taking advantage of that and drafting. 1029 03:00:08.130 --> 03:00:22.710 Policies and, as a committee, it is a little bit enticing part of this is how do we entice employers to see the benefits of having these plans. 1030 03:00:23.250 --> 03:00:34.380 Doing these preparatory walks routes that kind of thing is something that I think we could offer, and I also just want to clarify on the affordability thing. 1031 03:00:35.670 --> 03:00:53.640 I think one of the advantages of having a recommending some kind of legal responsibility is that we would attach to it, therefore, the state will develop some kind of fund. 1032 03:00:54.540 --> 03:01:06.240 To supplement this and make it possible for it to be enacted and that would be automatically attached to the concept of legal responsibility. 1033 03:01:09.270 --> 03:01:16.080 yeah and and I think you raised several points, one is sort of in the voluntary track, which is the guidelines is. 1034 03:01:16.440 --> 03:01:26.760 Like from what I heard is not just coming up with what are they but then, how do you promote them in a communication manner that makes it seem in tight like what you said enticing but also. 1035 03:01:27.360 --> 03:01:38.730 doable and something employers like just paraphrasing the win, win right of that voluntary, as well as potentially even adding training and resources and stuff on that voluntary pathway. 1036 03:01:39.150 --> 03:01:48.030 And then, for the little sort of legal responsibility pathway you're kind of also pointing out the need for funding or some other mechanism to help support employers. 1037 03:01:48.540 --> 03:01:57.810 In implementing if it's if there's a legal requirements yeah have been and anybody else have their hand up go ahead okay. 1038 03:01:59.400 --> 03:02:05.610 On the topic of scope there's just there's something else on my mind, I wanted to throw out that maybe we could consider as well you know. 1039 03:02:06.540 --> 03:02:18.840 One of the reasons why the OSHA framework places responsibility on the employer is because the employer is creating the workplace, the employer has much more control over what that environment looks like the workers, typically don't have that control. 1040 03:02:19.590 --> 03:02:24.810 And I know that there's precedent in the Cal/OSHA sphere to. 1041 03:02:25.530 --> 03:02:34.830 Regardless in a way of how someone may be hired whether they're hired as an employer or as an independent contractor there's precedent for OSHA going in and saying well look. 1042 03:02:35.400 --> 03:02:43.260 If you've created this workplace, regardless of how you've hired these people we're going to have the authority to investigate and decide. 1043 03:02:43.710 --> 03:02:47.640 If you have control over that workplace so I'm wondering if. 1044 03:02:48.630 --> 03:02:58.050 that's something else we may want to look at if we're thinking about the scope is sort of what is those criteria that OSHA has you Cal/OSHA and specifically has used before to. 1045 03:02:58.950 --> 03:03:08.220 sort of define the point at which someone is controlling that workspace if that makes sense, and you know, I think that also could get around. 1046 03:03:09.120 --> 03:03:19.800 it's another way of thinking about it, rather than looking at like if you hired someone just for an hour for a week or for months right it's regardless of how long you've hired someone if if you've taken a certain amount of you. 1047 03:03:20.910 --> 03:03:28.410 there's evidence that you've created this place this the end these conditions in which I was going to work with that triggers then your responsibility that could be another way. 1048 03:03:30.480 --> 03:03:40.380 we're going to write that in the follow up information and discussion needed for this recommendation, I think that that's like a clear example of that I'm Erica. 1049 03:03:42.900 --> 03:03:57.750 images to es una nonetheless area category Sarah simply lori's como ella haines's people request our anti are wasting. 1050 03:04:00.210 --> 03:04:01.050 commander more than. 1051 03:04:02.070 --> 03:04:09.930 The restaurant this one, you know proportional as normal minimises equity that but I know simply simply I was. 1052 03:04:11.640 --> 03:04:20.790 A second seven, a former they can OSHA they depress your net loss at the COMP plan that's enormous minimises agree that. 1053 03:04:23.340 --> 03:04:37.050 It does so, if I expect a homosapien to to not ask Kelly, because your muscle men of the city, no, no, no, no, that is a pen or arrow is para kale in public or set. 1054 03:04:38.070 --> 03:04:39.330 of police officer yes. 1055 03:04:44.340 --> 03:04:59.520 Oh good okay I got a county symbolically picasa on but Hello simply ago this is uh huh Okay, but it's going to propose it today, they came muscular atrophy carry so parking your second kelly's falter panoramic photo now. 1056 03:05:01.920 --> 03:05:15.600 But I can use men thing and bless me miss norma disagree that last minute because I mean seven meters MAS MAS portland significant in India mahal calcifications in his day. 1057 03:05:17.100 --> 03:05:19.350 Okay, so like a system of rating. 1058 03:05:20.730 --> 03:05:27.780 Okay grass yes Erica you know unlinked to I'm just going to look around our little chart if this is still working. 1059 03:05:28.470 --> 03:05:34.350 Around so we have some strategies that have been mentioned for the idea of legal responsibility. 1060 03:05:34.860 --> 03:05:38.730 And next time we come back we'll have it laid out for you in terms of how we what we've heard. 1061 03:05:39.120 --> 03:05:51.150 There are a few issues and, as I think leanne mentioned some are even called out in the bill that the committee is asked to consider we've talked a little bit about scope and flagged some questions and also recommendation. 1062 03:05:52.080 --> 03:06:00.990 That actually be for everybody, regardless of ours, at this point, we want to touch on privacy, because that is something that has come up. 1063 03:06:01.800 --> 03:06:08.190 You know, the committee has been asked to think about like So what about that concern for privacy and whether. 1064 03:06:08.640 --> 03:06:21.510 home can be treated the same as other work sites in that regard, or what what are some possible either other concerns or or ways to address that, and so I want to open that up to the committee for comments on that question. 1065 03:06:29.130 --> 03:06:31.980 Jessica, do you want to say something or not I'm not sure. 1066 03:06:33.840 --> 03:06:35.370 All eileen has her hand up. 1067 03:06:37.110 --> 03:06:47.250 yeah I feel very strongly strongly once your home becomes a workplace, it is a workplace, and it is no longer. 1068 03:06:47.880 --> 03:06:57.570 A so called private sphere, the notion of private sphere is a mythology and I feel extremely. 1069 03:06:58.230 --> 03:07:10.740 What is done in the name of privacy is done in privacy only when it's convenient for those in power and it's I think today's roe V Wade strike down and yesterday's gun. 1070 03:07:11.730 --> 03:07:25.890 augmentation shows so but there still is that feeling among so many people that somehow your intimate information would be exposed. 1071 03:07:27.270 --> 03:07:30.300 And I thought the original bill. 1072 03:07:32.490 --> 03:07:47.970 had something about guaranteeing people's privacy that that other information that's there is not going to be revealed just um yeah so that's what I feel like saying right now. 1073 03:07:49.980 --> 03:07:51.060 Thank you Megan. 1074 03:07:53.850 --> 03:08:03.150 yeah I want it, I think we'll be talking a little bit about some of the solutions that came up from the listening sessions more, but I just want to flag that some of the. 1075 03:08:03.660 --> 03:08:12.450 ideas that came from our our basic domestic workers and day laborers who who did the listening sessions did talk about. 1076 03:08:13.530 --> 03:08:23.100 Part of that tiered approach being you know, the ability to to get to compliance at different levels from calls to letters. 1077 03:08:23.820 --> 03:08:32.790 And, and then what came so that like once you get to compliance that home inspection isn't isn't necessary if you get to compliance to these other. 1078 03:08:33.600 --> 03:08:52.680 avenues and and there was a feeling from from workers that like that the home inspection is is an important recourse and and I think for him what came from some of the employer listening sessions, that I thought was really helpful was thinking about. 1079 03:08:54.750 --> 03:09:05.130 You know what kinds of hazards require that you know it doesn't have to be all you know if you're talking about mixing chemicals that doesn't have to be on site that could be at a Cal/OSHA office that could be. 1080 03:09:05.550 --> 03:09:13.410 If you're talking about different types of hazards that there's a lot of reasons why it doesn't have to be at the location and so thinking about both. 1081 03:09:13.860 --> 03:09:23.070 The graph and also then also employers mentioned the gravity if it if it's something that and I think that was written in the original bill as well around the gravity of. 1082 03:09:24.330 --> 03:09:28.140 You know, a serious injury of amputation or death or. 1083 03:09:29.370 --> 03:09:49.080 That that could require inspection on site and so just thinking about the different levels and approaches to in home inspection and and and how those those were coming out in the listening sessions as and again, or like So those are all different levels of. 1084 03:09:50.340 --> 03:10:05.940 compliance and that but also like escalation escalation of that enforceable undertaking that Cal/OSHA could have you know the request to inspect if nothing is getting complied with after multiple conversations with a willful noncompliant employer. 1085 03:10:10.470 --> 03:10:11.280 giulietta. 1086 03:10:13.080 --> 03:10:31.560 i'll just add quickly that in some of the employer brainstorming that I have participated in other employers have noted that maybe in that kind of graded enforcement scheme that self reporting would be a basis, like to where you would start. 1087 03:10:33.870 --> 03:10:36.570 What does that mean the worker. 1088 03:10:37.920 --> 03:10:55.260 employer self reporting so that just as a basis you require all employers to sort of self report to some body an organization or an agency that they've sort of understand some basic edgy self education around workplace hazards. 1089 03:10:58.680 --> 03:11:09.300 Justice acts to pull that out a little bit more Does that mean that there's that people are registering as important is that a registry of people who are employing or that their self reporting. 1090 03:11:10.770 --> 03:11:22.860 Yet not I mean at least just tell me a little bit more about it, I don't know that we talked about it in that way, but it could be, I mean it could conveniently also be a way to have a registry, I think. 1091 03:11:26.880 --> 03:11:45.450 Just just to be sure we understand, but the example you're using is, for example, if there was some required employer education and then the employer would have to go through that education and then report to an agency that they had completed it so that's the specific example. 1092 03:11:48.120 --> 03:11:48.390 Okay. 1093 03:11:49.410 --> 03:11:49.740 Thank you. 1094 03:11:50.910 --> 03:11:52.080 Nancy and. 1095 03:11:56.970 --> 03:11:57.450 Nancy. 1096 03:12:04.740 --> 03:12:09.870 Just, I just wanted to bring this up, because it bothers me how. 1097 03:12:11.130 --> 03:12:15.450 This condition it's so unfair to us. 1098 03:12:16.680 --> 03:12:19.410 My neighbor the other day was telling me that. 1099 03:12:21.540 --> 03:12:27.960 code enforcement from the CD came to her door because her husband. 1100 03:12:28.980 --> 03:12:40.800 installed on a window air conditioning and for the dripping of the water he decided to use like a pipe to drain the water, and this is. 1101 03:12:42.150 --> 03:12:58.200 An air conditioning that was installed in the House and code enforcement from the city was somebody made a company called in, because they wanted to complain about it and they went to check they went out to the House to check what is this. 1102 03:12:59.280 --> 03:13:18.150 It is not a person it's not as important as that will be enough of a person so talking about privacy, we are, we all are entitled to let this inspector come out to the House to check and see if there's something wrong. 1103 03:13:19.980 --> 03:13:24.810 Talking about privacy, if someone needs been abused in a home. 1104 03:13:26.130 --> 03:13:32.910 There was more reason for someone for culture for someone to go check on that. 1105 03:13:34.170 --> 03:13:52.260 So, to me, even though that's been a big issue the privacy of the homeowner of the employer, you know, this is the issue shouldn't be done, excuse me if someone is suffering sexual abuse in your home if someone is someone that hurt. 1106 03:13:53.760 --> 03:14:03.600 In your House in your home that's that's something that should be a you know someone should pay attention to that in check on that bottom line. 1107 03:14:05.220 --> 03:14:16.080 And and, of course, if your home is a workplace, yes, something has to be done when someone is is in danger or it's been hurt. 1108 03:14:17.430 --> 03:14:18.420 no question about that. 1109 03:14:19.740 --> 03:14:28.170 Thank you yeah Thank you Martha and I think that is at that has that's another thing that has been that has come up today is the other parallel. 1110 03:14:28.650 --> 03:14:41.580 settings when somebody from an agency does go to the home, you know it was mentioned this morning to and in your example as well that it's not it's not that totally unusual that there's some inspector or other who can go to home Nancy. 1111 03:14:43.860 --> 03:14:46.110 Can yeah just thinking a lot and I think. 1112 03:14:47.190 --> 03:15:00.840 What month is mentioning is is really important right, I was gonna say something about, just like the change in behavior and things that were mentioned earlier, but I think it's true right like just talking about that issue of privacy, I think that's. 1113 03:15:01.980 --> 03:15:07.920 An awesome where that it needs to be you know, in the policy recommendations and really. 1114 03:15:09.600 --> 03:15:12.600 Just kind of deciphering that a little bit better. 1115 03:15:13.650 --> 03:15:26.040 Because you know there's a lot of workplaces that aren't being inspected on a regular basis right so it's, not that this exclusion would. 1116 03:15:26.520 --> 03:15:43.710 You know all homes now are potentially you know, going to be inspected in that sense, but I think the idea of going back to a point that was made, I think Erica mentioned like something like a report card right, I think the idea of a registry could potentially also. 1117 03:15:44.970 --> 03:15:57.180 allow for that maybe it wouldn't be particular homes but maybe it could be like by district or by certain areas right, we would know in this area, you know, health and safety is at a C. 1118 03:15:57.870 --> 03:16:08.730 You know, or whatever category, but just to give us an idea I know that we workers day laborers do that indirectly right they know when they're certain employers. 1119 03:16:09.240 --> 03:16:20.160 Calm they know it's an Obama, that person doesn't pay me, you know and they start telling other workers so indirectly workers are already kind of doing this themselves. 1120 03:16:20.610 --> 03:16:30.270 But how do we add some of the strategies that we use around wage and our violations and use that towards health and safety right like How do we make sure. 1121 03:16:30.720 --> 03:16:42.720 That employers know what they need to do, but also workers right, and I think if Cal/OSHA could also collect some of that information that could also be useful in terms of knowing. 1122 03:16:44.160 --> 03:16:46.170 You know one other thing that I was going to say is. 1123 03:16:47.400 --> 03:16:49.950 In terms of what employers. 1124 03:16:52.080 --> 03:17:10.560 Just the incentives just thinking about when we're talking about like Kobe guidelines for domestic work, we were thinking also about accessibility affordability and we were thinking you know, one of the incentives for example is providing workers with rapid. 1125 03:17:11.820 --> 03:17:17.970 covert tests and then the question came about well, not an all employers could potentially afford that. 1126 03:17:18.750 --> 03:17:30.120 And so, then we were like Okay, what if we share right the resources of where employers could potentially get free antigen test, so that we can close that gap. 1127 03:17:30.540 --> 03:17:49.680 Right, so I think it's also a matter of the more we know who the employers are what are the we know what are their needs, then we can start to figure out and what we can either the department of public health state support and filling in those gaps around like affordability. 1128 03:17:54.000 --> 03:18:05.850 The issue of privacy really the concern when it's it's related to an inspection, I just wanted to admit that might be an obvious thing, but is that the context in which privacy is a concern or has been raised as a concern is it. 1129 03:18:06.660 --> 03:18:13.860 Is a complaint and inspector it doesn't have to I'm just wondering broadly if it's like we're going to tell people what to do in their home. 1130 03:18:14.970 --> 03:18:21.210 If there's it's really narrowly focused on the inspection process, just to check in it's not maybe that is. 1131 03:18:23.250 --> 03:18:24.360 [Spanish Language Spoken] 1132 03:18:29.250 --> 03:18:29.400 [Spanish Language Spoken] 1133 03:18:30.780 --> 03:18:30.930 [Spanish Language Spoken] 1134 03:18:34.080 --> 03:18:45.180 [Spanish Language Spoken] 1135 03:18:52.680 --> 03:19:06.270 [Spanish Language Spoken] 1136 03:19:07.950 --> 03:19:16.500 [Spanish Language Spoken] 1137 03:19:17.820 --> 03:19:22.470 [Spanish Language Spoken] 1138 03:19:23.490 --> 03:19:23.910 [Spanish Language Spoken] 1139 03:19:25.710 --> 03:19:38.550 [Spanish Language Spoken] 1140 03:19:42.510 --> 03:19:56.790 that you have a comment or yeah I did I just thought that's a great question, what do we mean by privacy and what is the meaning of it it's in our mandate, and I think. 1141 03:19:58.020 --> 03:20:07.650 it's so ironic that we're not worried about loss of privacy, by having employees in our House. 1142 03:20:09.360 --> 03:20:12.330 You can learn all kinds of things about. 1143 03:20:13.410 --> 03:20:24.510 You know, personal dynamics in relationships, you know policies around shoulder and all that kind of stuff and that's not a threat to privacy. 1144 03:20:26.100 --> 03:20:36.660 But what will be a product of threat is an inspector coming in and looking at it and I think we at least need to acknowledge that. 1145 03:20:38.130 --> 03:20:51.960 The root of this concern is more about protecting private property it's about property someone mentioned earlier, who controls. 1146 03:20:52.980 --> 03:20:57.270 Who who gets to control the work environment. 1147 03:20:58.410 --> 03:20:58.980 and 1148 03:21:00.300 --> 03:21:00.750 So. 1149 03:21:01.800 --> 03:21:13.080 Just notion of private property in this country is like so way out of proportion, so you can have private property, but you can have. 1150 03:21:14.370 --> 03:21:26.850 You can have as many workers in there, as you want, and nobody is challenging us, so I think is committee we gotta have a little bit of a perspective on that. 1151 03:21:27.540 --> 03:21:37.830 And that we could take advantage of what Suzanne was saying, that is just a small thing we're just talking about inspections that's the scope. 1152 03:21:40.020 --> 03:21:49.380 yeah I just thought oh I'm Laura and I just wanted to follow up on that point and and I kind of lag I think what Megan was talking about earlier that. 1153 03:21:49.920 --> 03:21:57.450 Part of the issue is, what does it mean to you know remove the exemption and say that employers have a legal responsibility to do things. 1154 03:21:57.840 --> 03:22:08.490 And if people have pointed out that legal responsibility is accepted in wage and hour so it's not that new a concept that in a domestic worker employer has legal responsibility. 1155 03:22:09.030 --> 03:22:15.420 that the question that we're discussing is what's been the difference between wage and hour and OSHA inspection. 1156 03:22:15.840 --> 03:22:26.160 And this concerned about privacy there and and positing the possibility that the main issue is about the inspection and once you hone in that way. 1157 03:22:26.640 --> 03:22:32.760 And then, if we were, you know as a committee thinks about Okay, what are the challenges So what are the strategies there. 1158 03:22:33.090 --> 03:22:41.520 And I feel like you know, I just want to flag a few that we have heard you know one is that to recognize that inspection is just one tiny way. 1159 03:22:41.910 --> 03:22:51.420 That Cal/OSHA even inspect something we know that, as people have said there's very few inspectors for the number of workers, there are so it's pretty rare. 1160 03:22:52.050 --> 03:22:58.050 That there's an inspection and in fact callosum has already been implementing things like letters and phone calls. 1161 03:22:58.440 --> 03:23:03.690 etc, and that is you mentioned their potential strategies around depending on the nature of the hazard. 1162 03:23:04.140 --> 03:23:12.450 Whether an inspection needs to be occurring, so I think it's really helpful to be honing in on this distinction and this particular. 1163 03:23:12.780 --> 03:23:21.510 concern that it's not a concern about the exemption and whether or not employers have legal responsibility because that exists in a lot of different arenas. 1164 03:23:21.960 --> 03:23:27.450 it's it's in the inspection, so I just want to flag what I'm hearing and see if that is kind of what. 1165 03:23:27.930 --> 03:23:33.690 you're all you know, does that jive with what you're thinking as well, in which case, as we move forward and think about. 1166 03:23:34.170 --> 03:23:51.240 strategies we might put forward in order to to you know, like if we were going to have these workplaces covered by kelo show what strategies, could we use around this one area that might address some of those concerns, so I don't know people have thoughts on that matter Martha and Kevin. 1167 03:23:53.070 --> 03:23:54.570 hi This is my son okay. 1168 03:23:56.070 --> 03:24:05.880 I thought about this before in a tragedy could be maybe instead of saying inspection or an inspector that will go to the home. 1169 03:24:06.780 --> 03:24:17.760 What about having a department that will take care of this stuff not studying, not with an inspector, but maybe a domestic worker with experience that can. 1170 03:24:18.630 --> 03:24:40.440 You know, go out to that home and point out, you know areas of danger or concern for the homeowner or the employer to to take care of or change things and make the home, a safe place for the you know for the for us. 1171 03:24:41.460 --> 03:24:51.360 That, I think that will be a strategy of not making it so scary or so serious, but at the same time, it can be taken care of. 1172 03:24:52.170 --> 03:25:02.070 And if he's not done, then we can go to another step, but just starting with that it will make the employer feel comfortable about that. 1173 03:25:02.730 --> 03:25:23.430 And not being concerned, maybe you know something like that that will help and at the same time, the relationship between the employer in the worker, it will then be so stressful you know something like that I thought up. 1174 03:25:25.170 --> 03:25:34.380 yeah Thank you so it's like as part of the tiered approach like building in one step which could be another resource Center that helps and I think if I'm. 1175 03:25:34.980 --> 03:25:41.580 If I'm remembering correctly Hawaii has something like that in their model where they have some nonprofit organizations, I mean not. 1176 03:25:41.970 --> 03:25:55.380 To help sort of do some of that triage and support if I hadn't remembered it did I not remember that correctly I'm forgetting where that's from also but some kind of I feel like a promo Dora type model where. 1177 03:25:57.720 --> 03:26:08.220 Community based organizations are are empowered entitled like through through through the power of Cal/OSHA to be supporting supporting with those. 1178 03:26:09.390 --> 03:26:17.580 To bring to help employers come into complaints to I wanted to add and just I mean, I think this question of where does the concern. 1179 03:26:18.030 --> 03:26:32.550 For around privacy come from, I do think we need to examine it more and to try to understand that as well, I think I think there is some some speculation happening around around like it being the inspection point. 1180 03:26:33.780 --> 03:26:45.660 And so we're you know it's good we're creating creating strategies around that but I think I think we need to examine it more like where's that coming from so that we can get to that to the root of the issue as well, because I think. 1181 03:26:47.400 --> 03:26:49.500 I think it's still a little bit and unknown. 1182 03:26:50.820 --> 03:26:51.180 So. 1183 03:26:53.310 --> 03:26:53.670 Kevin. 1184 03:26:55.470 --> 03:26:56.010 This is Kevin. 1185 03:26:57.180 --> 03:27:07.950 No, I mean just just to circle back, I really like this idea first of all that Martha raised in terms of the kind of a model, but just to go back to the question of responsibility again just not to lose sight of the fact that. 1186 03:27:08.610 --> 03:27:14.460 It employers have a responsibility as soon as an injury happens for domestic workers and day laborers so. 1187 03:27:15.060 --> 03:27:25.470 What we're proposing I think it's important for us to continue to reiterate what we're proposing here is only going to help to avoid this other realm of responsibility that you already have as an employer. 1188 03:27:26.130 --> 03:27:37.050 As soon as the injury happens so really I think it's really important for us to continue to kind of connect those two, even though I know that's not you know that's the worker's comprealm it's not OSHA but you know they're not unrelated. 1189 03:27:38.160 --> 03:27:48.780 And is the workers, just to clarify is that for any injury any length of time or does that kick in after the 52 hours it's the 52 hours or $100. 1190 03:27:51.270 --> 03:27:55.530 Okay, but that's a good point to with the legal responsibilities. 1191 03:27:57.150 --> 03:27:57.750 So I wanted. 1192 03:27:59.760 --> 03:28:00.570 My going on, or off. 1193 03:28:02.610 --> 03:28:14.280 I just want to Kevin to restate the full sentence yeah sure the worker's comprequirement kicks in if you are an employer hires a worker. 1194 03:28:14.670 --> 03:28:26.610 And that workers injured, if the worker has worked 62 hours or more, so a minimum of 52 hours or if they've been paid $100 or more within a 90 day period. 1195 03:28:27.180 --> 03:28:36.900 So 90 days, and that includes also if you hire someone and you anticipate hiring the for 52 hours or more or paying them 100 and they're injured say in the first hour. 1196 03:28:37.530 --> 03:28:48.840 If you had a contract or some sort of agreement that was going to cover a longer period of time you're still required to pay worker's compso that kind of gets to the the length of time issue, in some cases, anyway. 1197 03:28:50.820 --> 03:28:58.470 So I want to pose another question to the committee, which is another sort of issue that you were asked to consider related to recommendations. 1198 03:28:58.950 --> 03:29:07.830 which has to do with the fine system and sort of the you know the penalties that are typically issued and if that if you see that carrying over. 1199 03:29:09.180 --> 03:29:17.910 In a similar manner to a homeowner you know context as as a cause still staying within the consequences if somebody is not complying are doing what they're supposed to do. 1200 03:29:18.570 --> 03:29:35.760 Are there any comments on that and off the tiered approach that has been mentioned already can might might already be sort of that could be a possibility to flush this out as well, but any other comments or concerns around fines, the monetary you know implications of penalties. 1201 03:29:36.990 --> 03:29:40.350 That would come up with a with legal responsibility, we can. 1202 03:29:42.120 --> 03:29:45.030 just another food, food for thought. 1203 03:29:46.410 --> 03:30:01.080 Who will be penalized and who will be responsible, is that the employer or the worker in certain cases, for example, if the employer is the disabled and the worker Just to give you a scenario. 1204 03:30:03.030 --> 03:30:09.840 there's a disabled person in a wheelchair and couldn't prepare her food and she cannot afford. 1205 03:30:11.070 --> 03:30:24.900 A caregiver but she can only afford to pay a person to come over and just to do the cooking for the food, but when the worker comes into the House, the House is really a mess it's dirty you know. 1206 03:30:26.070 --> 03:30:35.940 it's not sanitized even you know, because the disabled, cannot do anything it's just at home, but he she can only afford to get someone to just cook food. 1207 03:30:36.420 --> 03:30:48.780 And so the worker says I'm just here just to cook food, not to not to clean up the House, and now we know that there is hazard there but who's responsible the worker or the employer. 1208 03:30:49.890 --> 03:30:52.770 whom are we going to penalize there in case like that. 1209 03:30:55.530 --> 03:30:59.550 Just just a scenario, because I have seen some situations like. 1210 03:31:02.490 --> 03:31:10.560 Oh we're real Cal/OSHA go there, the culture can go home inspection the caregiver I mean that the disabled cannot really do anything. 1211 03:31:11.700 --> 03:31:19.260 So the worker just comes in and he's only she's only paid to do cooking so that's all so who specialize there. 1212 03:31:20.010 --> 03:31:31.800 And how do we do you know I mean the legally the worker would never be penalized right that I mean just in the context of tallow side is that always the employers, responsibility and so when there's fines. 1213 03:31:32.400 --> 03:31:42.240 it's the employer who would get fine, but I understand what you're saying again is that the challenge of certain types of employers who either it's an affordability issue. 1214 03:31:42.660 --> 03:31:46.290 or another, another issue that makes it difficult to comply. 1215 03:31:46.890 --> 03:31:55.110 With all the with all the regulations, I don't know if anybody has any comments in terms of this kind of context and again supporting employers to do what they're. 1216 03:31:55.410 --> 03:32:06.300 supposed to do an elite Laura and then eileen well I just quickly was going to say that when we get into one of the subsequent vision issues around having a written agreement about tasks. 1217 03:32:06.750 --> 03:32:18.660 Some of the things that you're bringing up might be relevant and with that is something that's on our list that the value of having an agreed upon set of duties so just wanted to say that that will come up later. 1218 03:32:21.000 --> 03:32:27.810 What I wanted to say and connecting it to something we were talking before about if we had a. 1219 03:32:28.740 --> 03:32:49.380 what's called a try parte of panels made off of worker representative employer representative and government representative that was the overall inspectorate and if you were find the find would go into a. 1220 03:32:51.270 --> 03:33:08.520 A an account that then could be repurposed precisely for that employer of who can't afford to have someone come and clean up so that their attendance or their cook doesn't slip or whatever. 1221 03:33:09.690 --> 03:33:26.850 that there could be a way that the that these fines are connected to improving the system, rather than just, seeing as total of penalties to individuals so let's try to think about this in a more collective way. 1222 03:33:27.540 --> 03:33:39.870 Okay, thank you, I want to also I mean I'm realizing the time and we didn't take an afternoon break, because we also started much later in terms of our afternoon, but how are people we only we have about 40. 1223 03:33:40.740 --> 03:33:57.810 minutes 45 minutes left of the meeting and we're going to break by 330 for open it up for public comments or definitely wrapping up the discussion, do you want a five minute stretch break you want to keep talking, what is the pulse in the room around it. 1224 03:33:59.880 --> 03:34:13.980 I think five minutes okay let's do a five minute stretch break now and then we'll come back and wrap up this piece of the discussion before we go into public comment at 330. 1225 03:34:16.740 --> 03:34:28.410 So we're wrapping up this first, and you know as you saw the Charter is sort of the goals and visions were in the first time, this is also the one so that's the trickiest and actually has some of the potentially. 1226 03:34:28.800 --> 03:34:38.340 Issues that Fournier issues to talk about so we wanted to start with, that today, and I wanted to see we've talked about some of the issues. 1227 03:34:38.790 --> 03:34:51.180 or concerns that we had flattered at the actual bill flags to discuss in terms of privacy fines scope we brainstorm some solutions or strategies for how to address that are some comments. 1228 03:34:51.660 --> 03:35:01.410 On follow up does anybody have anything else that you want to comment on in terms of any of the issues or any other concerns that you think the committee should consider. 1229 03:35:02.490 --> 03:35:10.770 Besides what has been mentioned so far and I also want to particularly encourage anybody who hasn't had a chance, yet to share, if you want to. 1230 03:35:11.880 --> 03:35:21.840 comment or raise a question or anything at all for the committee, please you know, please do so before we conclude today so opening up for any comments or questions. 1231 03:35:24.120 --> 03:35:40.980 And, as well as you know, for those who are here, I know you're representing different you're representing different sector, so you can think like Okay, what would other workers think or what would other employers think i'll go ahead, Nicole Thank you um I think when we talked about like. 1232 03:35:43.380 --> 03:36:05.370 compliance and I think one thing that as a beginning stuff you could do is maybe make a checklist available to employers about things that they could be doing home to make it more safe for workers are not something that we do at hand in hand and that that's a good first step is. 1233 03:36:06.540 --> 03:36:17.580 is really talking about a tiered system like having a step, where everybody has a list of all the different things that they need to do in order to make it safe for brokers. 1234 03:36:18.270 --> 03:36:38.670 And then the other issue on the privacy, that I know has come up for 29 different employers is around when workers disagree with their employer, particularly around their personal care and. 1235 03:36:39.930 --> 03:36:41.520 Having conflict with. 1236 03:36:43.350 --> 03:36:53.460 With the work around how they want something done and that that has created and contact them were either the portal so that's not a safe thing to do, or. 1237 03:36:54.210 --> 03:37:10.320 The employer will say, well, this is the way I like to do it, because this is the way that works for me so there's no pressure, how you mitigate that but I think that that's an issue that could come up around employers and workers around privacy. 1238 03:37:13.530 --> 03:37:27.360 Thank you, and I will we will write that down as something for further discussion I think that's a that's a good point to raise in terms of how, how does it when there's differences of opinion or differences of how you know what's the support to help facilitate that. 1239 03:37:28.530 --> 03:37:31.560 um any other okay Nancy sorry. 1240 03:37:33.780 --> 03:37:48.360 yeah, I just wanted to also support what was mentioned right now around like sometimes those differences between what the worker thinks is best done with the employer thinks is best I think when we've done health and safety trainings with employers. 1241 03:37:49.380 --> 03:37:58.230 are generally recommendation usually is let's try to make sure that education for employer and employee mirror each other, they speak to one another. 1242 03:37:58.770 --> 03:38:08.700 To make sure that there aren't kind of those types of contradictions right about like what are the best practices what's the healthiest workplace for both essentially. 1243 03:38:10.080 --> 03:38:13.470 I just wanted to offer you know I did allude to. 1244 03:38:15.960 --> 03:38:17.820 leach claims and the way that we. 1245 03:38:19.020 --> 03:38:25.260 do that with domestic workers and day laborers right and thinking about the fines and the tiered system. 1246 03:38:25.620 --> 03:38:41.100 When we do that we don't just go straight to the Labor commissioner's office right there's like the mediation, where the organization is the one that supports the worker and having that conversation right maybe it is the employer doesn't know right let's say. 1247 03:38:42.270 --> 03:38:49.680 And then comes the letter if the employer doesn't then comes a letter formal letter from the organization stating this is how we might proceed. 1248 03:38:50.940 --> 03:39:01.320 If that doesn't happen, then we move forward right, so I think thinking about what we already do at least like organizations is also a good example. 1249 03:39:04.380 --> 03:39:15.570 yeah, and I mean that's an interesting addition to that what I understood to be the tiered system, which is a tiered system of enforcement from Cal/OSHA but it's you're even mentioning like if there is some legal basis there's even before. 1250 03:39:15.900 --> 03:39:22.770 Before involving Cal/OSHA there are steps that others could do, using the laws that as a tool or strategy. 1251 03:39:24.810 --> 03:39:33.240 I would love to just add on to that because I think something that was highlighted in the code enforcement model was the Community based organizations that support with both. 1252 03:39:33.720 --> 03:39:44.880 The empowerment and navigation of the legal systems, so all there's a lot of work that our organizations within coalition do before the legal process begins and and that. 1253 03:39:45.480 --> 03:39:55.260 Part of the effectiveness of code enforcement because that work is so important to support a worker to bring forward to claim if it's necessary but also to get resolved ahead of time, so. 1254 03:39:55.740 --> 03:40:07.860 In the domestic worker education outreach program we do see a lot of resolutions happen, ahead of the legal claims process as well, so just like another piece of how code enforcement functions as well. 1255 03:40:09.690 --> 03:40:15.600 What one quick comment I think it's a really important point that even when we do training at HP with with. 1256 03:40:16.110 --> 03:40:22.920 groups of workers who are covered by Cal/OSHA unambiguously the message is never to go to Cal/OSHA immediately. 1257 03:40:23.580 --> 03:40:28.470 You know the message is always try to resolve things internally first. 1258 03:40:28.860 --> 03:40:36.300 And so it feels like you know we're talking a lot about what to do when there's a violation and could there be an inspection, or what about fines which is important. 1259 03:40:36.780 --> 03:40:43.770 But I think I thank you for bringing up that as part of you know, guidelines or recommendations or education, you know. 1260 03:40:44.100 --> 03:40:57.150 there's a lot of work that could be applied and it's already being done around how to resolve disputes, well before you would ever reach out to an enforcement agency, even in workplaces where they're clearly covered by the law, so I think that's a really important point. 1261 03:40:58.590 --> 03:41:01.890 Julietta, am I pronouncing your name correctly, by the way, Julietta, okay good. 1262 03:41:02.940 --> 03:41:20.130 So I just want to go back to privacy, for one minute, but I think it's also connected to this question, I was thinking about actually the privacy of the worker who might have a complaint and making sure that there's a way to protect the worker from retaliation. 1263 03:41:23.490 --> 03:41:34.950 Thank you good yeah that's a good point that thinking about yeah both aspects of that and we do have the speaking up and being able to do that without retaliation as a vision goal to thanks for flagging that. 1264 03:41:36.240 --> 03:41:44.100 Any other concerns or suggested solutions or comments, based on your experiences we cannot have. 1265 03:41:45.360 --> 03:41:53.520 Based on what a ternary in aurora said that there are a lot of limitations and one of the limitation is the lack of staff from. 1266 03:41:54.210 --> 03:42:06.000 OSHA, so I would really suggest that there should be a department in Palo Alto or a section that will be responsible specific khalif for the household. 1267 03:42:06.720 --> 03:42:16.050 Services, because this kind of industry is really quite unique so if there is a very different section for that. 1268 03:42:16.710 --> 03:42:29.250 And also realize the importance of Community based organizations, if we can really strengthen you know Community based organizations, so that they can have more programs reach out to. 1269 03:42:29.970 --> 03:42:40.170 And do the enforcement, I mean implementations enforcement like that, under the guidance of the department section of. 1270 03:42:45.150 --> 03:42:49.020 Nancy sigh my thoughts are everywhere on my paper. 1271 03:42:50.190 --> 03:42:53.280 One last question or recommendation. 1272 03:42:54.300 --> 03:43:06.660 Could we get some information on I know in California, we had the carwash workers with like health and safety, and they I believe they created like a registering on wondering. 1273 03:43:07.470 --> 03:43:22.290 Like if there's any more information that we can get on it success or and or its challenges, too, because I know that registry was brought up in terms of like employers just if we can get some information. 1274 03:43:26.520 --> 03:43:28.290 Yes, that writing that down. 1275 03:43:30.420 --> 03:43:35.430 Any other comments I'm so looking at this, but I think we're good Megan. 1276 03:43:36.870 --> 03:43:46.560 is more of a process thing than content, but thank you very much for sending out questions ahead of time, the documents from from Kevin ahead of time, I think. 1277 03:43:46.950 --> 03:44:04.170 The only follow up to that as if we are able to say get them even more ahead of time as much as possible, so that we can bring that back to our base before beforehand and and be able to get consultation with with our base Okay, thank you leanne. 1278 03:44:06.330 --> 03:44:08.520 yeah this is process also. 1279 03:44:10.080 --> 03:44:19.110 Looking at Thank you very much for making that graphic and for separating the guidelines from the recommendations that was very helpful. 1280 03:44:20.370 --> 03:44:21.720 And, in line with that. 1281 03:44:23.400 --> 03:44:29.430 I'm just aware of how how far we already are into it and. 1282 03:44:31.140 --> 03:44:44.250 That it's another couple of months before we even will have a documentary respond to, so I just i'd like to see if any of that could get expedited or if the thing that. 1283 03:44:45.480 --> 03:44:47.580 Kevin wrote could. 1284 03:44:49.080 --> 03:45:02.310 play a role in that, because what I'm envisioning we've been doing a lot of divergent expanding brainstorming but we're at some point we're going to have to say what's the outside rim. 1285 03:45:03.180 --> 03:45:20.310 and come back in, and I think that's going to take some time and I interpreted what you did to be an effort to say, this is a potential outside rim so we're like saying we really are only going to have about 20. 1286 03:45:21.420 --> 03:45:24.750 Points rather than 300. 1287 03:45:26.010 --> 03:45:26.670 So. 1288 03:45:28.170 --> 03:45:36.000 Anyway, I would appreciate your leadership on that on how to get to the point where maybe next time. 1289 03:45:37.590 --> 03:45:44.100 We have a way of confirming something about what's the container. 1290 03:45:45.360 --> 03:45:45.900 and 1291 03:45:47.010 --> 03:45:56.490 yeah, thank you for mentioning that, and that was also part of our our setting some criteria to agree upon in terms of the kind of topics will. 1292 03:45:56.970 --> 03:46:02.190 Think about, and let me just give you a preview of next time, because I think for the next two months. 1293 03:46:03.060 --> 03:46:11.220 I really have it's been really great for us, I think, to have the committee be talking like we have been doing in the afternoon and in the next couple of months. 1294 03:46:11.520 --> 03:46:21.240 We are going to try to get we're going to look at the questions that you want answers to but really emphasize time to have this kind of exchange and have the time in the in the meeting be mostly. 1295 03:46:21.840 --> 03:46:29.700 be mostly that I think we're at the point where we can start to delve into those things, so what we had thought about for July is we've actually been. 1296 03:46:30.090 --> 03:46:38.670 Looking at the previous presentations on common hazards and injuries and sort of what the goals could be for the voluntary and then the as the. 1297 03:46:39.360 --> 03:46:48.630 As the layout as the things that we're going to talk about for the voluntary hazards, I mean the voluntary guidelines, and so we will look at that and, like some in a way. 1298 03:46:49.200 --> 03:46:59.550 You know, drawing on some other information on the standards kind of we can look at okay so chemicals, what does kelo should say what does the end TWA already have a some. 1299 03:46:59.880 --> 03:47:07.800 practical guidelines, what are some other resources, the committee has and what do we then want to move on, you know and then okay let's do it get ergonomics. 1300 03:47:08.130 --> 03:47:15.900 let's look at that and that's what we're going to start doing in July, looking at the Catholic categories and what the recent what the inputs are. 1301 03:47:16.440 --> 03:47:25.080 which include the Cal/OSHA rags and other if other advanced work has already been done and how what makes those most relevant in the House setting. 1302 03:47:26.130 --> 03:47:37.290 In August i'll come out in August we're going to come back to the policy piece and we're going to have written up you know, to the best where we what we heard today what that might look like in terms of. 1303 03:47:37.710 --> 03:47:47.730 An initial recommendation when we're going to then continue working through the other squares in a similar manner, I mean helping to hopefully. 1304 03:47:48.750 --> 03:47:57.180 revisit any issues that we need to hear, but this first one is honestly like that the thorniest, as I said right and so we're going to go through the vision. 1305 03:47:57.570 --> 03:48:06.720 and see so okay for the number two that there's a written agreement, so what strategies, who has to promote that is that legal is that not legal. 1306 03:48:07.050 --> 03:48:17.400 What are some issues and then we'll go to number three and work our way that way, and this is kind of the basis that we're seeing for the policy recommendations at least to sort of advance. 1307 03:48:18.420 --> 03:48:22.890 You know and get to draft which we can then still massage in the fall. 1308 03:48:24.000 --> 03:48:25.290 Megan, what do you have. 1309 03:48:26.520 --> 03:48:34.410 No, I think that that sounds great I I was just wondering if for July on the same wavelength as we and just thinking about. 1310 03:48:34.860 --> 03:48:51.600 Can we already pull together those inputs to look at you know some like a draft form of the inputs that we've already been receiving had like for the July meeting and versus like saying like do we want this do like just to have it already draft drafting and then we can. 1311 03:48:52.890 --> 03:48:56.190 And then we could say no, we don't you know we don't want this included we do. 1312 03:48:58.080 --> 03:49:07.050 Yes, and are we actually have an intern Leslie has been working on that, so I will we will work on that to see. 1313 03:49:07.890 --> 03:49:15.060 What we can share ahead of time and if it's good I mean what's going to be the most challenging is sort of looking at the calendar regs for a topic and lifting up. 1314 03:49:15.510 --> 03:49:32.160 The maintenance, I know, Carmen help us last time with laying out some of the ones that apply based on the TV analysis Kevin is adding and that's something that we have to will try to do is share an input chart if I mean share chart ahead of time as a take off point. 1315 03:49:34.260 --> 03:49:44.100 yeah just to add, because I think, especially in looking at the standards themselves it'll be a fair bit of work, I think, to go into each one and really read through them and descend decipher. 1316 03:49:44.730 --> 03:49:46.560 What would apply what would not apply, so I mean. 1317 03:49:47.010 --> 03:49:52.260 The extent to which we could some of that work could be done in advance, I think it can be hard, I think, with the whole committee to do it so. 1318 03:49:52.500 --> 03:50:01.800 I wish they were also a way like for some of us almost to get involved on the side to just like help with that not that I'm volunteering everyone for work, but you know something. 1319 03:50:02.910 --> 03:50:05.010 Some way to kind of like divide up that work, I think. 1320 03:50:06.990 --> 03:50:10.920 Just one question and I know Suzanne and I are going to discuss this, but. 1321 03:50:11.550 --> 03:50:17.160 It is important to know what standards already exists that's a piece of the conversation but it's about the whole conversation. 1322 03:50:17.580 --> 03:50:23.370 It feels like when we get to the volunteer to the guidelines, that is, you know, the starting point, there is. 1323 03:50:23.790 --> 03:50:32.460 What do we think needs to happen to make these workplaces safe and we want to be able to kind of articulate that and and I know people have spoken. 1324 03:50:32.910 --> 03:50:38.880 very forcefully about the need to provide employers with guidelines and workers to about how to make that work safe. 1325 03:50:39.270 --> 03:50:48.990 So I'm just saying that that is in itself a valuable exercise to be able to say here's what we need to have happen if you're working with chemicals, you need to know about what they are. 1326 03:50:49.320 --> 03:50:56.910 You need the personal protective equipment or gloves, if necessary, you need to have like air, you know circulating or ventilation. 1327 03:50:57.420 --> 03:51:08.190 And, and so you know it could be that there's a little bit of a you know, a step thing that defining what that is and then you know what regulations relate to that. 1328 03:51:08.550 --> 03:51:18.570 You know, can be plugged in so I just want to kind of make that distinction that at least you know what I had been thinking and we're still talking about it, obviously, is that. 1329 03:51:18.960 --> 03:51:29.700 that's what those voluntary guidelines are, this is what people should do the policy recommendations are where we go into be able to you know if the if you all have recommendations about. 1330 03:51:30.120 --> 03:51:37.050 This is what should be required, and now that we know what we think we want, we want training and we want personal protection. 1331 03:51:37.620 --> 03:51:46.230 protection equipment, etc, what are the regulations that apply that we want to be covered by, or are there, new regulations that that we want to develop so. 1332 03:51:46.890 --> 03:52:04.620 So I think that that when we're talking about the guidelines were a little bit not don't need to be fine excuse me to what the regulations, I think the regulations let's take off point right ideas for what we might want to institute, but it is, I also want to just ECHO, in a sense that. 1333 03:52:05.850 --> 03:52:14.640 We should pick potentially if we're it might be some screening, because that I think that was a recommendation from the committee could be that the agency. 1334 03:52:15.060 --> 03:52:22.230 That have a process after this to look at the existing regs and develop something tailored Here are some examples. 1335 03:52:22.560 --> 03:52:32.820 We don't necessarily need to do all that or I don't even know if we can in this process, but in the guidelines we can lift the top level priority recommendations that for each hazard. 1336 03:52:33.180 --> 03:52:40.200 You would want employers and employees to be educated about to prevent injury if that makes sense we'll see. 1337 03:52:41.340 --> 03:52:52.230 We do need to end for public comments I'm going to let Martha have the last comment, and then we do want to have some time for the public comment, though sorry, thank you. 1338 03:52:54.090 --> 03:52:57.000 Just one one thing that i've been concerned about. 1339 03:52:58.590 --> 03:53:09.510 We haven't talked about health and safety when a pregnant pregnant woman it's cleaning a house health and safety symbol right we. 1340 03:53:10.200 --> 03:53:29.310 vacuum pick up heavy stuff that can affect the baby have a miscarriage or something can we have something like that to protect us well it happened to me, I have two daughters and if we have some guidelines or information about what can be done or. 1341 03:53:31.290 --> 03:53:37.830 How you call it when you're you're absent you don't work sick accident or something I don't remember how it so. 1342 03:53:39.060 --> 03:53:58.440 When you have the baby oh yeah pregnancy maternity leave yeah let me after you have yeah yeah it's a status, a baby, you know for a few days or whatever so just thinking about health and safety, involving women that are pregnant and working can we think about something. 1343 03:54:00.030 --> 03:54:07.950 about that, I mean that's something for the committee could think about was we're looking at hazards if there's ones that are particularly of concern for. 1344 03:54:09.120 --> 03:54:19.260 Either being a reproductive hazard or something that would particularly impact pregnant that's a that's a lens yeah that you could think about okay so. 1345 03:54:19.980 --> 03:54:32.760 Public comment I think we're at that point, thank you, everybody for your participation, this afternoon, and thank you to the terms of the public who have waited patiently while we've gone a little bit over we appreciate you coming to share public comment. 1346 03:54:49.680 --> 03:54:57.480 Alright we're opening up the meeting for public comment is there anybody in this room that would like to provide public comment at this point. 1347 03:55:00.840 --> 03:55:02.550 All right, we have we have one person. 1348 03:55:03.960 --> 03:55:04.110 1349 03:55:06.660 --> 03:55:08.040 1350 03:55:12.150 --> 03:55:12.630 1351 03:55:31.980 --> 03:55:44.400 [Spanish Language Spoken] 1352 03:55:45.030 --> 03:55:58.530 [Spanish Language Spoken] 1353 03:56:06.480 --> 03:56:16.230 [Spanish Language Spoken] 1354 03:56:17.520 --> 03:56:18.960 1355 03:56:20.010 --> 03:56:20.280 Right. 1356 03:56:23.940 --> 03:56:29.100 Okay, now we are opening it up for public comment on our zoom line. 1357 03:56:30.690 --> 03:56:44.010 So I see if you want to provide a comment, please raise the hand emoji on the zoom feature, so I see we have Kenia, we have Deb Scott. 1358 03:56:46.110 --> 03:56:50.310 Jenny, can you please give your first and last name and proceed. 1359 03:56:52.020 --> 03:57:01.560 [Spanish Language Spoken] 1360 03:57:04.290 --> 03:57:18.030 [Spanish Language Spoken] 1361 03:57:19.080 --> 03:57:30.690 [Spanish Language Spoken] 1362 03:57:31.440 --> 03:57:40.740 [Spanish Language Spoken] 1363 03:57:41.610 --> 03:57:53.460 [Spanish Language Spoken] 1364 03:57:55.440 --> 03:58:05.280 [Spanish Language Spoken] 1365 03:58:07.140 --> 03:58:09.600 [Spanish Language Spoken] 1366 03:58:12.510 --> 03:58:32.100 [Spanish Language Spoken] 1367 03:58:33.480 --> 03:58:40.380 [Spanish Language Spoken] 1368 03:58:41.970 --> 03:58:43.650 [Spanish Language Spoken] 1369 03:58:45.240 --> 03:58:45.630 Thank you. 1370 03:58:49.770 --> 03:58:55.680 Thanks, thank you, Kenia our next hand I don't see a last name, but Kenia. 1371 03:58:58.140 --> 03:59:01.290 Kenia can can you announce your first and your last name. 1372 03:59:04.800 --> 03:59:17.460 [Spanish Language Spoken] 1373 03:59:18.450 --> 03:59:30.390 [Spanish Language Spoken] 1374 03:59:31.800 --> 03:59:37.050 [Spanish Language Spoken] 1375 03:59:38.130 --> 03:59:42.600 [Spanish Language Spoken] 1376 03:59:43.650 --> 03:59:47.910 [Spanish Language Spoken] 1377 03:59:49.170 --> 03:59:58.080 [Spanish Language Spoken] 1378 03:59:58.740 --> 04:00:12.840 [Spanish Language Spoken] 1379 04:00:14.850 --> 04:00:24.480 [Spanish Language Spoken] 1380 04:00:26.160 --> 04:00:43.410 [Spanish Language Spoken] 1381 04:00:45.420 --> 04:00:50.580 [Spanish Language Spoken] 1382 04:00:52.200 --> 04:01:07.110 [Spanish Language Spoken] 1383 04:01:11.160 --> 04:01:19.890 [Spanish Language Spoken] 1384 04:01:20.880 --> 04:01:31.290 [Spanish Language Spoken] 1385 04:01:31.980 --> 04:01:36.510 [Spanish Language Spoken] 1386 04:01:37.410 --> 04:01:48.120 [Spanish Language Spoken] 1387 04:01:48.810 --> 04:02:03.060 [Spanish Language Spoken] 1388 04:02:05.040 --> 04:02:15.840 [Spanish Language Spoken] 1389 04:02:16.800 --> 04:02:31.290 [Spanish Language Spoken] 1390 04:02:32.730 --> 04:02:40.440 [Spanish Language Spoken] 1391 04:02:40.920 --> 04:02:51.750 [Spanish Language Spoken] 1392 04:02:53.790 --> 04:02:54.720 Thank you. 1393 04:02:55.860 --> 04:03:00.300 We have Claire Michaels, Clair Michaels can you say your first and your last name. 1394 04:03:01.320 --> 04:03:02.220 Claire Michaels. 1395 04:03:03.330 --> 04:03:05.160 And you may proceed. 1396 04:03:06.390 --> 04:03:16.980 Hi, my name is Claire Michaels and I employ a domestic worker who does childcare in oakland California I'm also a member of Hand In Hand, the domestic employers network. 1397 04:03:18.120 --> 04:03:24.690 As an employer we've tried to maintain open and honest communication with our nanny about how to handle health and safety concerns in my home. 1398 04:03:25.230 --> 04:03:30.690 we've outlined what to do and there's a possible Covid exposure for either of us and we've come to an agreement on our own. 1399 04:03:31.080 --> 04:03:39.330 But we would have preferred for there to be set guidelines to follow in order to know when she should come in versus stay home for her own safety and the safety of our family. 1400 04:03:39.900 --> 04:03:46.740 We also tell our nanny to avoid picking our daughter up as much as possible to protect her from possible injuries related to ergonomics. 1401 04:03:47.100 --> 04:04:00.690 It would be helpful to have guidelines about how often she should pick her up or to earn like until what week she weighs more to be able to provide her with specific scenarios when it would be okay, for example, if she was wearing a back brace. 1402 04:04:02.070 --> 04:04:09.720 I support guidelines for health and safety for domestic unemployment, because I believe all workers, deserve a safe place to work. 1403 04:04:10.050 --> 04:04:16.410 And because I know that employers want to protect their families and the people who care for them that they often don't know how to do it. 1404 04:04:17.370 --> 04:04:29.640 Having guidelines would prevent me from being held liable for something that went wrong, it would also provide the opportunity to present clear boundaries around the safety of my child in the context of talking about safety of my employee. 1405 04:04:30.750 --> 04:04:41.790 However, it would be helpful to feel that these boundaries are arbitrary but clear expectations put out by the government, for us, both to follow, for this reason, these guidelines are not enough. 1406 04:04:42.870 --> 04:04:47.640 For this reason, guidelines are not enough and employers also need guidelines to become a right. 1407 04:04:48.390 --> 04:04:56.430 Implementing these guidelines, may be a challenge, because many employers don't have formal agreements on many aspects of the work that caregivers do. 1408 04:04:56.910 --> 04:05:08.760 So, in order to make this happen we'll need to start a holistic process of more open two way communication and more formalizing of relationships between employers and their employees. 1409 04:05:10.380 --> 04:05:23.940 I support guidelines for health and safety for domestic employment, because I believe all workers, deserve a safe place to work and because I know that employers want to protect their families and the people who care for them, but they often don't know how to do it, thank you. 1410 04:05:25.380 --> 04:05:31.050 Thank you very much do we have anybody else on the zoom line that would like to provide public comment at this point? 1411 04:05:34.140 --> 04:05:43.680 Alright, I don't hear from anyone, I don't see any hands on the screen, I believe this concludes our public comment for today's meeting, thank you. 1412 04:05:48.780 --> 04:06:02.250 And I think that also concludes our meeting for today, so thank you everybody so much for your participation today, we found it really, really helpful and useful for moving forward. Have a good rest of your afternoon- well, evening.